Baldur's Gate 2 Plot improvements

[Andyr]

True, but you can't become any sort of deity without it. What I'm saying, is Irenicus could become a deity even without worshippers.

[NiGHTMARE]

He seems to have plenty of monstrous followers, couldn't some of them worship him?

[BigRob]

Possibly. Some of his old friend in the jars in his stronghold seemed very loyal, even after being suspended for so long.

[Guest Dio]

I can't stand the way that you're just shoehorned into the whole Ust Natha section of the storyline, and I wish the writers had given it a little more thought.

 

As it is you're just 'recognised' as some people the Drow have been waiting for from another city to conduct a rescue mission. That... seems very unlikely, on the face of it, and perhaps needlessly so.

 

We already have the fighting pit in the tavern, and perhaps a better plot progression might be this: the party can ask around, pretending to be looking for employment by a House. This would naturally lead them to the answer that Phaere's house (I forget the name) is currently pre-eminent in Ust Natha, but that joining them isn't easy if you're an outsider with no credentials. Some might suggest to try fighting in the pits to see if you get noticed.

 

If you do go to the pits, one of two things can happen; either you see Lasonar (male duellist) fight and accept his mano-e-mano challenge, or you click on Chalinthra (female duellist) and accidentally spill her drink, leading her to demand satisfaction in a duel. Either way, if you beat one - Lasonar is a loyal skilled fighter in Chalinthra's service - the other is furious and is about to call you out when Solaufein and a Matron arrive, looking for Lasonar and Chalinthra to embark on the rescue mission to save Phaere. Upon seeing that half the team's already been killed, Solaufein is also furious, but the Matron reins him in, and opens the possibility of asking your group to help rescue Phaere. Time is short, there's no time to gather more warriors etc. Some judicious questioning on the part of the PC can reveal that the army of Ust Natha is 'out on maneuvers', a little fact that should fill some NPCs with foreboding.

 

From there, the plot proceeds as normal, with Phaere adopting the PC and his companions into her house and using them to orchestrate her schemes.

 

Just a little tweak - it wouldn't take much - and I feel the storyline would hang together much less incredulously. Other situations that could use this work in SOA and especially TOB come to mind, but I'll think on them before posting alternative rewrites - anyone got any pet hates in the plots they think deserve to be ironed out?

[BigRob]

I can't stand the way that you're just shoehorned into the whole Ust Natha section of the storyline, and I wish the writers had given it a little more thought.

 

As it is you're just 'recognised' as some people the Drow have been waiting for from another city to conduct a rescue mission. That... seems very unlikely, on the face of it, and perhaps needlessly so.

I believe that Adalon actually disguises you as these people, complete with looks, clothing and House insignia. But for outsider drow, you do pretty much just stroll into the city and take up with the premier House immediately. At the moment, I can't remember if matron Ardulace is expecting Veldrin and company or not...

[BobTokyo]

I can't stand the way that you're just shoehorned into the whole Ust Natha section of the storyline, and I wish the writers had given it a little more thought.

 

As it is you're just 'recognised' as some people the Drow have been waiting for from another city to conduct a rescue mission. That... seems very unlikely, on the face of it, and perhaps needlessly so.

I believe that Adalon actually disguises you as these people, complete with looks, clothing and House insignia. But for outsider drow, you do pretty much just stroll into the city and take up with the premier House immediately. At the moment, I can't remember if matron Ardulace is expecting Veldrin and company or not...

I think she is. It would be nice if Adalon just had one or two lines explaining that she'd killed Veldrin and co, or if you could ambush them somewhere in the underdark before the change. Maybe Adalon could name them as among the drow you killed near the imprisonment sphere?

[BevH]

I don't know if Adalon killed Veldrin & co., but she does remark that she's had them "dispatched".

 

And no, Matron Mother is not expecting Veldrin. You are presented to her because of saving Phaere and terrorizing the svirfneblin and offing the beholder. Matron Mother does remark that there's something odd about the PC. But otherwise, you're just accepted as drow. Which I thought was rather amusing given the fact that armor color doesn't change with the transformation.

[Regullus]

My Pet Plot Peeve: The Imoen is a bhaalspawn?! Ridiculous. Hard to explain all that money and time I spent resurrecting her in BG1, BG2 and ToB. I accept the plot device but I have never believed in it.

 

I did not mind the Yoshimo saga except for one minor detail: I never killed Tamoko. (Well, once, just for the armor. ) It would have been nice if there had been another option as there is in the Drizzt case.

 

What I Would Have Liked to Seen: When I played BG2 the first time,I thought Imoen was going to betray the pc because she was under the control of Irenicus. (The belt she was wearing.) I think that it would have been more interesting than the Yoshimo betrayal. Imagine, you arrive in Spellhold and your "sister," the non-bhaalspawn, betrays you, you fight to free her from his corruption, etc.

 

Just Plain Silly: The whole I need to rescue Immy but let me do months of silly quests. You make the 15,000-20,000 too quickly. If you rescue her as soon as possible then there is the immediacy of the Irenicus finale. What is the player supposed to do? Take a couple months to finish the quests and get a stronghold and then I'll get Immy's soul back? The elven city needs me but...? I think that could be easily remedied by allowing you to wander around doing quests and asking questions that lead you to the thieves guild and/or Bohdi instead of being forced to the slum area.

 

I thought a lot of the strongholds were silly, or too long. Nalia's Keep, too long and not believable. The bard/playhouse - Too long. I think each one had problems.

 

I loved the romances but all had their unbelievable side and if your beloved sister is captured by a madman and being tortured do you really feel like nookie? Especially, agonized, and high maintenance nookie?

 

Lastly, I struggle against my taint but I have no difficulties in my path. All those alignment choices but you get cheaper prices and more experience if you are good?

 

I could go on but the post would go on too long. In spite of my rant I do love much of the game.

[BobTokyo]

I don't know if Adalon killed Veldrin & co., but she does remark that she's had them "dispatched".

 

And no, Matron Mother is not expecting Veldrin.  You are presented to her because of saving Phaere and terrorizing the svirfneblin and offing the beholder.  Matron Mother does remark that there's something odd about the PC.  But otherwise, you're just accepted as drow.  Which I thought was rather amusing given the fact that armor color doesn't change with the transformation.

At the gates you are told you're expected and sent to meet Sola. If you're not expected by the matron mother, then on whoose authority have you entered the city, and who told Sola to expect you? Rescuing and serving Phaere gets you the audience with the Matron Mother, but Veldrin & Co. were expected.

[Domi]

I loved the romances but all had their unbelievable side and if your beloved sister is captured by a madman and being tortured do you really feel like nookie? Especially, agonized, and high maintenance nookie?

 

Well, you do not know she is your sister when you start a romance, just a brat that somehow jumped into it all and got herself arrested so now it is your headache to rescue her... A nookie might be just what the doctor ordered. And if the whole of the Sword Coast chose to cry into your mailed shoulder, well, it is somehow logical that those who love you the most contribute to your mail rust-scouring bills going through the roof the hardest.

[NiGHTMARE]

My personal theory re: Imoen is that she's actually a grandchild of Bhaal rather than his daughter. It would explain her lesser taint, etc.

 

In fact, I'd like to know when and how Bhaal learned of his impending death. Since he has an adult dragon as a grandson, it must have been at least a couple of hundred years before BG2.

[Bri]

Domi is quite correct Regullus. Often, when people are under stress, they do engage in sex to help release the tension somewhat. Sure, it is ephemeral, but sometimes it is nice to lose oneself in their passions.

 

Heh, but I won't disagree with too many of the other plotholes brought forth. Like the one with Imoen being a Bhaalspawn all of a sudden. If she was, then she shouldn't be able to be ressurected at all.

 

And yeah, I personally had a problem with BG2's assumption that Tamoko was dead. I know when I beat BG1, she survived. Now, I could see her encouraging stories of her own death...and briefly entertained notions of seeing her as an NPC in BG 2.

[BevH]

At the gates you are told you're expected and sent to meet Sola. If you're not expected by the matron mother, then on whoose authority have you entered the city, and who told Sola to expect you? Rescuing and serving Phaere gets you the audience with the Matron Mother, but Veldrin & Co. were expected.

This is true. However, there is more than one Matron Mother, so it could have been even then Matron Mother of Sola's house. My impression is that Ardulace wasn't expecting you.

[BevH]

My personal theory re: Imoen is that she's actually a grandchild of Bhaal rather than his daughter.  It would explain her lesser taint, etc.

 

In fact, I'd like to know when and how Bhaal learned of his impending death.  Since he has an adult dragon as a grandson, it must have been at least a couple of hundred years before BG2.

Argh... this is one of my biggest problems with the storyline of both games. Bhaal must of known of his impending death at least 10 years prior to the Time of Troubles. Time of Troubles occured in 1358DR and BG1 starts in 1368DR. You are told that you are 20 years old at the start of BG1. So, yeah, in order to have an adult half-dragon son and an adult half-dragon grandson (which is what they would be since the father isn't dragon), a century or two would be a good estimate.

[Regullus]

My personal theory re: Imoen is that she's actually a grandchild of Bhaal rather than his daughter.  It would explain her lesser taint, etc.

 

In fact, I'd like to know when and how Bhaal learned of his impending death.  Since he has an adult dragon as a grandson, it must have been at least a couple of hundred years before BG2.

My personal take on Immy the Bhaalspawn was that her mother was a follower of Lathander or some other good god and protected her baby from the full affect of the taint with her devotion to her god. That is the best explanation that I could come up with but I still don't buy it.

 

Time line is definately off.

 

I agree that stress nookie would have been believable if not appropriate for the game rating.

 

"Milady..."

 

"Shut up Anomen and kiss me." You wrestle desperately with the straps that secure the full plate mail...