Yoshimo and Jaheira

[dragonjewel13]

In reference to the Yoshimo romance mod:

I've decided to focus on a few inter-party banters for a while (My dialogues between Yoshimo and CHARNAME are friggin' long, so it's a nice change of pace) and I've decided to tackle the initial ToB banter between Jaheira and Yoshimo; should CHARNAME decide to resurrect him, how would she react? And here's my conundrum:

Part of me kinda feels like she would throw a fit and then leave. After all, she's already not overly fond of Yoshimo, plus we already know that she doesn't approve of resurrection if it isn't keeping with the balance (and I won't delve too much into the resurrection scene, but I guarantee she won't find it orderly). It's just how I see her personality: explosive and rather unforgiving.

However, I don't want to force people to lose Jaheira forever, and part of me thinks that maybe I'm just looking at her from the wrong angle. Any thoughts?

[KIrving]

Hmm....that is a difficult one. Personally I don't want to have to choose between the two being in the party.

One thing I have seen with Jaheira is that, although she may have an initial outburst about it, she is quite capable of calming down, thinking things through and talking about how she feels with the PC or other npcs.

As long as she gets a chance to be heard, I think she can come around to accepting the resurrection of Yoshimo. In my opinion she could even, eventually, forgive him.

[cmorgan]

I think you can play it both ways. She could have one heck of alot to say *before* the ressurection [one extensive argumentative and possibly brutal CHAIN of conversation], but after it is accomplished, you can probably just leave her as very strained and critical, watching him very carefully for a long time. Once <CHARNAME> has said "Let There Be Yoshimo", you can bet that the player behind <CHARNAME> wants to keep both, and you can probably bet that Jaheira would go along with it (She doesn't leave if you redeem Jon Irenicus, and she doesn't leave if you have Sarevok with you in ToB, and all Yoshimo did was operate under a geas. The other dudes *wanted* to kill <CHARNAME> as a personal matter.)

[berelinde]

I like the route cmorgan outlines. She could object like hells before, but accept afterward.

 

Yoshimo wouldn't be consulted on the matter anyway, since he's dead. Ressurrection is between the PC initiating the action and Ilmater, in this case. Ilmater certainly favors ressurrection, even if Silvanus objects. After all, in 3E, there's a prestige class for the twice-martyred, so ressurrected souls enjoy a certain communion with their god. Yoshimo wasn't necessarily martyred, but his god has no objection to the act of ressurrection.

 

Opinion differs about whether or not Yoshimo was operating under a geas, so you've got that decision to make. Do you want to write the mod as if he was, or do you want to write it leaving the ambiguity intact. Personally, I think he was, but that's your decision.

[Hide and Seek]

She could accept Yoshimo, as she accepts that the PC revives and takes Sarevok with them, despite him killing Gorion. But I reckon it would be the cold shoulder for a while.

 

True, Yoshimo operated under a Geas, but his actions led to the killing of Khalid. Would Jaheira ever forgive someone who had a part in that? (don't know how she responds to the redemption of Irenicus)

[Kulyok]

She could accept Yoshimo, as she accepts that the PC revives and takes Sarevok with them, despite him killing Gorion. But I reckon it would be the cold shoulder for a while.

 

Yeah, same here.

 

True, Yoshimo operated under a Geas, but his actions led to the killing of Khalid. Would Jaheira ever forgive someone who had a part in that? (don't know how she responds to the redemption of Irenicus)

 

Did he assist Irenicus in capturing PC after Baldur's Gate, then? I do not recall that... I thought he only helped capture PC in Spellhold?

[Hide and Seek]

Did he assist Irenicus in capturing PC after Baldur's Gate, then? I do not recall that... I thought he only helped capture PC in Spellhold?

I may have rushed ahead of myself here. It was a mod component that included Yoshimo's diary that told of him assisting in the capturing.

 

Though, in the SoA intro, there are some people looking very Kara-Turan in appearance, garb and weaponry.

 

"They came as you rested, shrouded or clouded in mist".. I don't really remember.

[Kulyok]

Yeah, probably Yoshimo assisting in capturing the PC isn't strictly canon, then.

[Domi]

Seeing that Jaheira minds but doesn't walk away from Irenicus ressurection in the Longer Road, I think we have a fine tradition that Jaheira is just all talk and no actions kind of character, that we are all ready to invent every possible reason for her to stay, too afraid to make the player lose her over anything at all. So, I see no way for Jaheira to stand in the way of Yoshimo joining the party; or PC joining Gromnir in destroying the world in a fit of madness. Or falling in love with Melissan and giving up her/his essence so Melisssan could become the new Lady of Murder. There is absolutely nothing you can do that you can't convince Jaheira to accept.

[dragonjewel13]

See? I knew I was missing something. She's quick to snipe, but she *does* stick with the PC no matter what happens. I think I like the idea of her fussing about the possibility before the event and then giving Yoshimo a piece of her mind... but eventually coming to terms with the event.

Besides, the only PC that can bring Yoshimo back to life is one that has formed either a close friendship or romance with him, something that Jaheira would be likely to understand after a while, yeah?

[Lady Fiana]

See? I knew I was missing something. She's quick to snipe, but she *does* stick with the PC no matter what happens. I think I like the idea of her fussing about the possibility before the event and then giving Yoshimo a piece of her mind... but eventually coming to terms with the event.

Besides, the only PC that can bring Yoshimo back to life is one that has formed either a close friendship or romance with him, something that Jaheira would be likely to understand after a while, yeah?

 

I agree. Jaheira is very loyal to the PC. Not to say she doesn't have a breaking point but if she didn't leave when Sarevok joined I don't imagine she would when Yoshimo comes back.

 

I can see her giving him a royal chewout. I also think she could eventually forgive him.

[Ayce]

One thing to consider in this whole discussion is that Yoshimo was part of the party and then betayed them all. Such betrayal was not a factor with Sarevok and Irenicus (I didn't know he could be redeemed, or is that some sort of mod). Still, Yoshimo was under a geas, but the betrayal and his involvement with the death of Khalid have got to sting more than the enmity with Sarevok and Irenicus.

[KIrving]

All the times I've played the vanilla game I never got the impression that Yoshimo was involved in the death of Khalid. Am I missing something?

 

Yoshimo offers support to Jaheira when she sees Khalid's body. He also expresses concern for her during the game. Those conversations do not sound anything like the veiled (sometimes guilty seeming) questions and responses he gives to the PC during the game.

 

If there is a mod that implies a conspiracy with Yoshimo regarding the characters capture and some of their deaths in Irenicus's dungeon, then frankly, I think they have taken quite a leap of judgement.