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Double Damage vs. Type Creature


Demivrgvs

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Does it work as per description? Because it appears just as a +'x' damage vs. Type Creature...

Opening The Daystar with NI i've found it has 4 Use EFF files (two are the +2 to hit and damage vs. evil) and the other two should be the double damage...both of them actually. One is placed under the melee header and the other one outside of it; the latter is identical to the +2 to damage vs. evil effect except that it appears as having a save vs. spell with +8 bonus! :) The Use EFF file under the melee header refers to an EFF file that deals magic damage to undead...even here it seems that a save is allowed. :)

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Well i thought that double damage was something the engine didn't know...but if it is so i don't see why there are some weapon's descriptions that say "double damage vs. Type".

Anyway i suppose that to obtain a 1d8+2 sword which deals "double damage" i can add a +6 to damage...the character will never know that the second 1d8+2 roll always results in an average value.

But than onother doubt arise: if a weapon has a +2 vs. evil and +6 vs. undead effects does it means that it will deal +8 vs. an evil undead or the bonus don't stack?

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Where should i put the dice value/size? I have something like this...

 

Signature EFF

Version V2.0

Signature 2 EFF

Version 2 V2.0

Type Damage vs. Type bonus (179)

Target Type unknow (0)

unknow 00 00 00 00 h

IDS target General.IDS - 3 / Undead - 4

Duration instant/while equipped (2)

Time 0

Probability 1 100

Probability 2 0

unknow 00 00 00 00 30 63 40 00 h

Savetype save vs. spells (1)

Savebonus 8 ---> is this really a save bonus?

parameter? 0 ---> what is this parameter?

parameter? 0 ---> DIE.EFF put here the -4 value for the save or death effect

unknow 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 h

unknow 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 h

unknow 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 h

parameter? 4 --> where i usually put damage bonus (tested and it works)

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Is this some old NI listing?

I think the dices are between probability and save type.

But, somehow you left out some numbers there, as you left only the resource field as unknown.

 

Also, i said damage opcode, not this damage creature opcode.

You need to chain #177 (ids targeting) with #12 (damage)

You can chain #177 multiple times, just avoid loops.

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Yes i'm using NI...do you think some other editor would be better?

Anyway chaining (177) an (12) i'll have something like this:

 

Signature EFF

Version V2.0

Signature 2 EFF

Version 2 V2.0

Type Damage (12)

Target Type TargetPresetTarget (2)

unknow 00 00 00 00 h

Fixed Damage "..."

unknow 00 00 h

Damage Type "..."

Duration instant/permanent (1)

Time 0

Probability 1 100

Probability 2 0

String

Savetype "..."

Savebonus 0

parameter? 0

parameter? 0

unknow 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 h

unknow 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 h

unknow 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 h

parameter? 0

.....

 

There're no other lines between probability and savetype even if in the EFF descriptions Gort linked to me (thanx for that!) there shoud be the Dice Thrown and Dice Sides lines.

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Interesting, i'm pretty sure NI would list all fields, just as they are written in IESDP, if only by 'unknown'. I cannot really help with NI. I would recommend DLTCEP, just because i wrote it :)

 

In your list probability/string/savetype, the string is the placeholder for the resource field. After that, there should be the dice size/count fields.

These fields are very important for a damage opcode, so it is impossible NI wouldn't list them correctly.

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Comparing and studying Daystar/Dragonslayer and Mace of Disruption i've come to some strange conclusion:

 

Signature 2 EFF

Version 2 V2.0

Type Damage (12)

Target Type TargetPresetTarget (2)

unknow 00 00 00 00 h

Fixed Damage "..."

unknow 00 00 h

Damage Type "..."

Duration instant/permanent (1)

Time 0

Probability 1 100

Probability 2 0

String

Savetype "..." ---> in reality it's the number of die so save vs. spell (1) means one die

Savebonus 0 ---> it seems to work as the dice size, in fact daystar has 8 and the mace has 6

parameter? 0 ---> savetype? :)

parameter? 0 ---> in DIE.EFF Disruption & Azuredge have "-4" (the save penalty to avoid death)

unknow 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 h

unknow 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 h

unknow 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 h

parameter? 0

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There's no double damage vs. type opcode, only damage vs. type. Daystar uses four EFF files. The sword, by itself, does 1d8+2.

  • evilhit2, attached globally, adds the +2 to hit against evil creatures.
  • evildam2, attached to the melee ability, which does an extra 2 damage to evil creatures (raising damage to evil creatures to 1d8+4 total).
  • daystar1, on the melee ability, which does an extra 1d8+4 against undead (combined with the base damage and evildam2, this raises total damage to undead to 2d8+8).
  • dbldam, on the melee ability, which does another 1d8+2 to undead, raising the total undead damage to 3d8+10. This actually looks like it needs to be dropped.

Dragonslayer does 1d8+2 base, supplemented by two EFFs on the melee abilities:

  • sw1h32a does an extra 1d8+2 to dragons, raising total dragon damage to 2d8+4. (This one is oddly targeted and may not actually be working.)
  • sw1h32c does an extra 1d8+2 to dragons, raising total dragon damage to 3d8+6, assuming if sw1h32a works.

There's no way to actually do double damage; you see that the swords just use an EFF which adds the sword damage again against the selected target.

 

Looks like the Fixpack might have some work to do here.

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In my installation Daystar has only DBLDEAD.EFF (which does magic damage) attached to melee ability while the other 3 .EFF are attached globally. And yes...it actually end up doing triple damage instead of double.

 

Dragonslayer would do too triple damage but the .EFF attached globally has Error (-1) in targettype so it probably don't work.

 

I'm glad someone noticed this oddities too...i would have reported it for the fixpack but i wasn't sure i was right cause my knowledge on these things is rather limited! :)

 

P.S I hope someone could help me solving the problem about missing lines in .EFF files open with NI!! :)

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The target type doesn't play in attached effects, it will be the same as in the original effect.

 

And as i mentioned, i think it is possible to do double damage :)

Use #177, chained if you need, to select the target.

Use #12 to damage the target with xdy+z

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Ehh, you don't even need to chain the effects.

I just realized (i think i knew this before), that #179 is a combined #177/#12 effect.

 

If you observe the daystar effect by a REAL editor, you will see it :)

 

daystar1.eff has dice sides/count as 1d8, and param3 as 4, which brings you a sum of 1d8+4.

Isn't that the same as the main weapon effect?

So, it is really double damage. 1d8+4 from the normal weapon effect, and 1d8+4 from daystar1.eff

 

[edit]

Bigg is right, though. The double damage against dead is implemented twice.

Once with the chain i suggested (using dbldead), and once with daystar1.

Both works, thus causing triple damage.

I think the wielding effect using #179 is better than the chained effect, because the chained effect will be loaded everytime you hit with the weapon, while the equipping effect will loaded everytime you equip the weapon. (by the way, #177 is needed only to have a param3, because V1 effects don't have it).

So, if you don't need 1d8+4, only 1d8, you could put #179 right in the equipping block.

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