NPC Attributes

[Bursk]

Ergopad, would you consider doing one of your charts for BG2 NPCs?

[Ergopad]

And what you mean by "charts"?

 

EDIT: If you mean by my excel sheets, then I don't think BG2 NPCs need tweaking since they are pretty much balanced.

[Miloch]

I think he meant a spreadsheet, which would also be good for your modded BG1/Tutu NPCs.

 

Well first of all, you should use WRITE_LONG 0x18 to assign the correct XP, rather than WRITE_BYTE. Same goes for READing the kit value (or writing it). Using the IESDP CRE page as a reference, look at the size (datatype) field. Anything 1 = BYTE, 2 (word) = READ/WRITE_SHORT, 4 (dword) = READ/WRITE_LONG and if it's signed (if it can take a negative integer, like AC) you're safest READing it as SSHORT or whatever the datatype is. Anything longer is usually READ/WRITE_ASCII (or ASCIIE if you want it to evaluate a variable). Anything shorter (like a bit) should be read as a BYTE and then operated on using BOR/BAND or other bitwise operators (as described in the WeiDU documentation).

 

Still with me? Ok, instead of OUTER_SPRINT ~CreFile~ ~%tsu%minsc.cre~ you can usually just use %SOURCE_FILE% in your macros, which will operate on whichever file you're currently patching.

 

As previously mentioned, you shouldn't have to ADD_KNOWN a spell if you're going to ADD_MEMORIZED it, as the latter handles the former automatically.

 

Some of the Tutu CREs might be garbled (maybe this is what you mean by "bugged") meaning the spell order and other things can get all messed up. Pretty much all of the CREs actually. So, to confuse you further, you want to make sure they're valid before patching them, enforce the proper CRE order and make sure they use v2 EFFs instead of v1 while you're at it. Luckily, Nythrun has written macros to do all those things.

[Ergopad]

Well, I think I stick with these changes, at the moment. I know it's kind of dumb removing all spells and then adding, but it's huge job to go through if all the correct spells are in the spell book, NPC by NPC and level by level. And I really have to say, that those spell lists are so horrible, that I don't know if I should cry or laugh (like with Quayle's horror spell ). So I think it's good to reset the spell list and make it from scratch.

 

Understand your concern about bytes and words, but as long as it works good... Gotta try Nythrun's macros too. Agree fully with that experience points though.

 

So I can remove those ADD_KNOWN_SPELL commands from rangers for example?

 

It complains something about translation when I compile it, why?

 

At this point, I'm not going to concern about the bug with deleting existing innate abilities from kits, since there aren't any good fully working NPC kit mods... yet. And speaking of which, it would be quite simple to implement the kits to NPCs really...

 

But, I haven't really tested the whole mod, except compile and see the results from .cre-file. So I really must do that next. And gotta see Dudleyville's fixes again and see if I miss something, like some spellslot fixes are still unimplemented.

[Bursk]

Yeah, like in posts 8 and 10.

 

I'm just curious to see what your "secret formula" comes up with for the BG2 NPCs.

[Miloch]

So I can remove those ADD_KNOWN_SPELL commands from rangers for example?

Well, if you want them to know and memorise a spell, use ADD_MEMORIZED_SPELL only. If you want them to know a spell but not have it memorized, use ADD_KNOWN_SPELL.

It complains something about translation when I compile it, why?

Not sure, what's the exact error? I don't think I saw any TRAed strings, so as long as you're installing it in your game folder...

At this point, I'm not going to concern about the bug with deleting existing innate abilities from kits

I've made a feature request for this. We'll see if anything comes of it.

since there aren't any good fully working NPC kit mods... yet.

Well there is Montaron as Assassin, Khalid as Fighter/Mage (both in BG2 Tweaks I think), Branwen as Battleguard of Tempus and Viconia as Nightbringer of Shar (both in Divine Remix) and of course Level 1 NPCs. All those work by patching so should be fine after your mod, in theory. And of course, the aforementioned EasyTutu NPC Kits which would have to be installed before anything, since it overwrites the CRE files.

And speaking of which, it would be quite simple to implement the kits to NPCs really...

Yeah, probably. You could do the whole thing in a macro that reads the kit and removes/adds spells based on the entry, but if you're going to make it really sophisticated and cover all mod kits too, well Level 1 NPCs already does that.

[Guest Guest_Ergopad_*]

Yeah, like in posts 8 and 10.

 

I'm just curious to see what your "secret formula" comes up with for the BG2 NPCs.

 

Well, I can do that. My "formula" calculates the quality, so that one high stats is better than bunch of fair stats. That's because most of the stats don't give bonus (nor penalty) if 5...15 or very very small bonus/penalty. Unlike in D&D3E, though I still like AD&D better. I try to come up some kind of a sheet later today...

 

I really liked the (idea of) NPC Kits, but I feel bad as its not working. Is somebody still working with NPC Kits? Gotta try the those kit mods, that you mentioned, when I next time start to play BGTutu.

[Miloch]

How do I make an integer array in weidu?

ACTION_FOR_EACH i IN 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 BEGIN
 OUTER_SET $j(i) = i
END

If you're doing it in a patch (instead of outside one, which requires an ACTION) you can use a normal FOR and thus avoid having to list all the integers like I did. There's probably a better way...

And there is, since I was ignorant of the OUTER_FOR command (was looking for ACTION_FOR instead):

OUTER_FOR (i = 0; i < 11; i += 1) BEGIN
 OUTER_SET $j(i) = i
END

Just leave off the OUTER_s if you're doing it in a patch (i.e. while COPYing something). You could also try to get fancy with the undocumented ACTION_DEFINE_ASSOCIATIVE_ARRAY, but I wouldn't worry about that for a simple integer array.

 

And one other thing I noticed:

Ok, instead of OUTER_SPRINT ~CreFile~ ~%tsu%minsc.cre~ you can usually just use %SOURCE_FILE% in your macros, which will operate on whichever file you're currently patching.

Actually, you don't have to worry about either of these if you use DEFINE/LAUNCH_PATCH_MACRO instead of DEFINE/LAUNCH_ACTION_MACRO since you only need them while patching (COPYing) CREs, they don't need to be ACTION macros. Therefore, they will always be operating on whatever the SOURCE_FILE is - you don't need to define that separately.

I really liked the (idea of) NPC Kits, but I feel bad as its not working. Is somebody still working with NPC Kits?

I don't think so. I think once Level 1 NPCs came out, Macready said he wasn't really going to maintain it anymore, but you could always ask him on pocketplane.net if he minds if you update it to a fixed, patching version.

[Ergopad]

 

Here's BG2 stats, with my "secret formula"

 

Keep in mind, that Edwin has bonus spells and Cernd is strong when werewolf shape... And generally speaking, none of these NPCs isn't really bad, like in BG1. Plus they all are very well done and have their strengths. Though I'm quite happy with my formula and I think I can fully agree with the results...

 

Miloch: That patch macro is just the thing I was looking for earlier, thanks. And those arrays things helped a lot.

 

How buggy is Level 1 NPC mod? Are the spells wrong? Are the innate abilities missing?

 

When I run the script, it says "ERROR: No translation provided for xxx@. Continuing despite error. Warning at src/dc.ml.xxx"

[Icendoan]

What is your Secret Formula, because you should try and factor in class with relation to stats, IE, Edwin has 18 in his Prime Requisite, and an optimal constitution, but he is at the bottom of your list.

 

Icen

[Bursk]

Arthur Slugworth and I will one day have your secret formula, Ergopad!

 

Thanks for the BG2 chart.

 

Regarding your BG1 changes, I plan to implement a variation of them in my game using the next version of L1NPCs (the current version doesn't have stat changes as an option). However, I can't really see what benefit Quayle will get. I'm personally going to keep his stats the same as in the stock game, other than a +3 boost to his wisdom. This'll only result in a bonus 1st level spell, but at least it's something.

[Ergopad]

Here's actual changes for Quayle:

 

+2 STR, +2 INT, +4 WIS and +6 CHA

 

Sounds like I'm giving too big boost to his stats, doesn't it? But now, look his total stats and tell me that these are too good for him?!

 

STR 10 (+2, for capable wielding mace)

DEX 15 (+/- 0)

CON 11 (+/- 0)

INT 19 (+2, like the idea, that there is one really intelligent person)

WIS 14 (+4, now he is a proper cleric)

CHA 12 (+6, come on, his so adorable with those glasses )

 

 

Now, I'm thinking about fixing the proficiencies, but don't if I have energy to do it.

[Bursk]

Oh, I didn't see anything wrong with your changes, but couldn't understand why you hadn't boosted his wisdom.

[Ergopad]

Oh, that was the mild version, so people wouldn't scare off, because of huge stat boost.

 

I'm still open for changes, if somebody has suggestions and explains to me why the stat should be changed.

 

Here's the list of current stat changes:

 

Branwen +2 WIS

Eldoth +2 INT and +1 CON

Faldorn +2 DEX and +1 WIS

Garrick +3 INT, +2 STR and -2 WIS

Khalid +1 DEX

Quayle +2 STR, +2 INT, +4 WIS and +6 CHA

Tiax +1 DEX and +3 WIS

Yeslick +1 CON

Coran -1 DEX, +2 STR

Kagain -1 CON +1 STR

[Miloch]

How buggy is Level 1 NPC mod? Are the spells wrong? Are the innate abilities missing?

Actually, the v1 available from this post is surprisingly bug-free AFAICT. Unfortunately, folks have been downloading the buggy beta7 from the official page, but we're working to fix that. I'm pretty sure it covers spells and innates, otherwise more people would've complained by now. The NPC Kit mod is a different story.

When I run the script, it says "ERROR: No translation provided for xxx@. Continuing despite error. Warning at src/dc.ml.xxx"

Can't reproduce - your last tp2 installed without a glitch on my EasyTutu with WeiDU v208. If you've made changes since then, reupload it so I can try to see what's going on, or paste more from your DEBUG file, if there's more useful info there.

 

The proficiencies should be relatively easy by comparison, using the commands I mentioned earlier. You could also restore the BG1 weapons they should have with REPLACE_CRE_ITEM. (Of course, that'd mean you'd have to give Quayle +5 STR for his flail, but it's not like that'd make his stats overpowered or anything.) I'd already started a component for that a while back, so maybe I could help out, though you probably work faster than I do .