4-player, Single-class Party in SCS2

[nataben1314]

I was thinking that maybe a fun, difficult tactical challenge would be to try to do SCS2 with all components installed to maximize difficulty, with a 4 player party where no multi- or dual- classes are allowed, so only single-class and kits. Surely this must be doable, since lots of people have solo'ed SCS2, but I'm wondering what the best party for this would be?

 

A few possibilities I thought:

 

1) Sorcerer

2) Cleric of Lathander

3) Blade

4) Berserker

 

1) Sorcerer

2) Swashie

3) Inquisitor

4) Blade

 

1) Wild Mage

2) Cleric of Lathander

3) Berserker

4) Inquisitor

 

1) Barbarian

2) Druid

3) Sorcerer

4) Swashie

 

The list goes on... I think this might be a fun challenge for me (I am not a tactical genius).

 

Any ideas?

 

EDIT: Also just to clarify, I'd like to have some diversity in my party, so nothing like 2x sorc and 2x blade, or 4x sorc, or stuff like that, please.

 

Also, random question, but is there any mod that improves shapeshifters but does not make them crazy overpowered like Weimar Shapeshifter Rebalancing?

[Shaitan]

For the fun of it take the wild mage. Should your other NPC's be home made or Bioware/modded NPC's?

 

I think in a future version of SCSII DavidW might put in improved shapeshifting - like he did with SCS.

[nataben1314]

I think I will use custom characters instead of NPCs.. I'm bored of the interactions by now anyways so this is no problem.

 

I wonder if a pureclass druid can make a good contribution to a 4 character party... I always liked pureclass druids but unfortunately it sometimes seems like all they are good for in a party is three spells (summon fire elemental, nature's beauty, insect plague).

 

I know that having multiple arcane caster (like sorcerer + blade, or wild mage + blade) would be powerful... but I kindof like the in principle idea of:

 

1 arcane caster

1 divine caster

2 tanks or 1 tank 1 thief

 

I guess I am not totally averse to taking 2 arcane casters but I have just never been a huge fan of arcane magic in BG2 for some reason :/

[Shaitan]

Well it's long time since I last played a pure druid, so I don't recall their strengths/weaknesses. Perhaps that's what you are going to discover You can go through without an arcane caster, but I think it'll be a hard time...

[Raj]

I'd use the sorc as arcane caster in place of wild mage because of that unlucky wild surge that destroy all party gold, and that can potentially break the game if it happens while you are collecting the increased price for Gaylan Baele and you installed the 120k option ( that means you need to have 90k in your pocket before Valen shows with the alternate proposal ); you can keep your money safe keeping all the loot in bags and not selling anything before you are sure than doing so is going to net you the necessary money but it can be stressful Having to do most of chap 2 quests in order to collect the money means you are going to be of mid-high level before the underdark, and there're few high level spell scrolls around so learning good spells might get tricky while a sorc can chose what he wishes on level up.

 

I suggest a support caster as well because you need to dispel many defences on enemy casters, usually a antimagic attack has to be followed by a breach before the mage puts on another spell defence: you are going to maximize difficulty options so the inquisitor dispel is getting nerfed, bit pointless to use one then when you could go for a bard ( blade kit is ok ) with their fast level progression and maxed remove magic, plus breaches and antimagic as well;.

Late in ToB the inquisitor is going to get pummeled heavy as well because of fewer hla than a fighter ( less hardiness if you want whirlwind too ), bad armor class and almost no survivability ( can't cast armor of faith/DUHM to soak blows compared to the many defensive buffs a blade can memorize ).

You are not allowing multiclasses in your game and I find it a nice/funny limitation, but then a bard is sort of multiclass imo, and when I play one (expecially blades) he ends to be a fighter/mage with a easier early game; a bard trademark is the song and it's not going to be very useful in a little party (again, expecially blade's one, and with only one more fighter ) so I predict you aren't going to use it often, and the differences between a bard who doesn't sing and a fighter/mage are negligible.

What about jester? It's a very underrated kit but the song is the best and cheapest disable availabe in the game, and the playstyle can can be different and more stylish

 

A berserker/barbarian is the ideal tank; powergamer choice between the two depends on which if any item/qust mods you installed, because barbarian is the best ToB choice in vanilla/refinements when you are given the chance to become next to immune to phisical damage, but then berserkers can come close to that if you can get some special rewards from Questpack hell trials or Ascension that improve phisical dr, or the many dr% items from Item Upgrade/Revision for example. Overall there's not much difference between the two, I'd go berserker because you can have a easier early game with better armor class provided by full plate and longer lasting rage ( berserker one lowers ac by 2 while barbarian one increases it by 2, I never understood why that ).

 

4th slot I'd go for the priest and forget about a thief: you have knock spell or can bash locks with high strength, the warrior can trigger a trap and soak the damage with hit points, or a caster can use mirror images and avoid most harmful effects, bard can pickpocket; thief can make things safer if you opt for a no-reload challenge, but then I'd take it in place of the tank, making hack&slash slower while safer. On a normal game thief is not needed/a weaker choice if you opt for a no multiclass/4 men party imo.

If you use vanilla spells I'd take a druid ( really any kit is fine here, if you are interested in shapeshifter without making it cheese with that old tweak, try Refinements ) because of the insect plague and similar, the fast level progression up to 11-13 when you get multiple uses of that and chaotic commands ( with wonderful recall ) and that's all you need along with a nymph and a fire elemental here and there. In ToB having ironskins up is a lot safer than the limited armor class the cleric can reach in order to avoid spellcasting failure.

If you opt for Spell Revision mod then clerics get a good boost, expecially in the party-buff spells, while druids lose chaotic commands; the druidic fire elemental at level 6 is no longer the best early summon availabe either, and you shall enjoy the good ole skeleton warriors.

I'd go Helm kit because of the cheap True Sight, Lathander has the +1 attack spell but berserker&blade are better at that job and I'm suggesting you to keep the party allignment neutral to avoid the many unholy blights/words SCS2 priests like to throw at the party; evil make turning undeads a bit disappointing, and you want to use your own holy smites/words.

 

Of these, I'd make the sorceror or the bard protagonist: you are allowed a familiar, you get a better stronghold ( mage one provides useful items too ), in late game you can buff to be next to invulnerable; the berserker can be the safer choice in the early game but surviving some encounters against high level mages/uber thac0 and dmg bosses as a unbuffed frontliner is a matter of luck ( again this doesn't matter if you allow yourself to reload, and the tank is the one going to collect most kills, that usually makes players feeling better for their child of Bhaal ).

 

Edit: <3 blade, go jester suggestion included

 

Re-Edit: You were debating about your preference for only one arcane/divine caster while I was replying so we're back to the classic priest+mage+fighter+rogue party; among all thieves kits the bounty hunter is the one offering more tactical opportunities and the chance of using traps in a ''almost'' no cheesy way ( throwing the special ones during combat ), yet I find it hard to concentrate on playing one properly if he's not my protagonist/soloer but that can be true for all thieves, they end being keys with legs with a single backstab opportunity sometime; swashies are even more boring.

[Demivrgvs]

Also, random question, but is there any mod that improves shapeshifters but does not make them crazy overpowered like Weimar Shapeshifter Rebalancing?

Yes, check Refinements, it does a much better job imo.

 

I wonder if a pureclass druid can make a good contribution to a 4 character party... I always liked pureclass druids but unfortunately it sometimes seems like all they are good for in a party is three spells (summon fire elemental, nature's beauty, insect plague).

If you want to try out Spell Revisions I assure you druids have far more than a few useful spells, and if you don't want a multi or dual one I'd suggest to try the Avenger kit.

 

I know that having multiple arcane caster (like sorcerer + blade, or wild mage + blade) would be powerful... but I kindof like the in principle idea of:

 

1 arcane caster

1 divine caster

2 tanks or 1 tank 1 thief

I'd say:

 

- either a sorcerer or a Conjurer (the former is more powerful if you know exactly which spells you need, else the Conjurer allows far more options sacrificing a little raw power)

- either a cleric or a druid (a cleric it's easier to handle imo and more party-friendly, but the druid gets extremely interesting offensive spells, especially with SR)

- either a barbarian/berserker or a paladin (Inquisitor kit rules them all imo)

- if you want a secondary tank who's able to handle traps and scout areas I'd suggest a Swashbuckler, especially if you don't care about backstabbing it's a gorgeous kit

[Raj]

I woudn't suggest a Conjurer because he's going to miss True Sight, and the level 6 arcane version is the one able to dispel lich illusions; being liches one of the opponents that give more problems to scs2 players having to wait for the cleric to reach the high 30s for a dispel is asking too much, a improved invisible lich is devastating.

 

It could work with a bard as support or with a priest of Helm/Inquisitor innate true sight that are considered higher level than the normal level 5 divine spell afaik; or buy every true seeing scroll you see keeping them for lich fights/get lucky with the book of infinite spells.

 

It's the only true disadvantage of Conjurers but it's a harsh nuisance if you ask me

[Guest!]

If you're going for sheer powerplaying I'd suggest this formation:

 

- Wild Mage: by the time you're halfway through the game, you'll be casting area of effect Wishes with a level 1 slot. Besides, it's a lot of fun.

- Inquisitor: True Sight, Dispel Magic, Carsomyr.

- Bounty Hunter: because playing BG2 without a thief is a pain in the ass. And you get the best traps with no real drawbacks.

- Wizard Slayer: one of the most powerful and underrated classes, it turns any mage from death on wheels to a walking sack of experience.

[Jarno Mikkola]

Well, if we want to make a "Single-class Party", we choose the class to be mage(...mage, mage and mage).

 

But if we want to have a party that doesn't have no multies or duals, we take:

Warrior, in my book the best is Kensai or Berserker.

Healer, Priest of Lathander

Thief, Assassin

Arcane caster, Sorcerer

And that's all folks. With the standard none-mod added kits

[Icendoan]

Tank -> Barbarian or Berserker.

Healer -> Cleric of any kind. Lathander adds no bonus to healing

Thief -> Bounty Hunter (those traps are amazing...)

Caster -> Wild Mage (More versatile than a sorcerer, in the long run)

 

Icen

[nataben1314]

Thanks for all your ideas, guys.

 

Refinements HLAs look interesting... is there a general consensus on if they are a lot more powerful than regular HLAs? I am not adverse to adding power in general, but for this run in particular I would like to keep things rather difficult.

 

I will also check out this Spell Revisions mod and see how it looks... if it doesn't seem overpowered I will give it a try... nice to add variety to the game.

 

Question: If I use Spell Revisions or Refinements, will the SCS2 enemies also have those same abilities, or will they have the original ones?

 

Party-wise, so far I am going along these lines (this is a combo of power + my personal tastes):

 

1) Sorcerer. I choose over wild mage because while wild mage has awesome potential (like AoE wish), I would rather have consistency... then have to reload from horrible wild surges... Conceptually I guess I just think sorcerer is more interesting.

 

2) Druid. Seems to have more offensive spell potential than Cleric, and I like druid better. There are lots of healing spells in the game anyways, so access to healing isn't super important to me.

 

3) Barbarian. I just think these guys are cooler than berserkers... and they are still quite powerful in their own way! Its also fun to be able to use a variety of weapons for me, instead of just getting grandmastery in a couple weapons.

 

4) This one is very much still up for grabs. Power wise I am guessing blade would be best... but somehow I'm not sure if blade feels right for this party, since as someone else mentioned it seems functionally equivalent to a multiclass. Bountyhunter is somewhat intriguing... can those special traps be effective without cheesy???

 

If I don't have a thief it is OK, because I can just install no traps/locks component... does SCS2 add lots of traps? Because if it doesn't then I have no problem installing this component... traps and locks are just tedious to me and I don't care about losing the bit of xp. That said, i'm not against using a thief, just saying it isn't a necessity.

[DavidW]

Question: If I use Spell Revisions or Refinements, will the SCS2 enemies also have those same abilities, or will they have the original ones?

 

The original ones. Sorry, I'm not that clever!

 

If I don't have a thief it is OK, because I can just install no traps/locks component... does SCS2 add lots of traps?

 

None at all.

[nataben1314]

I decide to start today with just SCS2, Rogue Rebalancing (only Chosen of Cyric component), Dungeon-be-gone, and a lot of components from BGTweaks. Also, since I originally was going to play IA, I had baldurdash installed instead of Fixpack... hopefully this does not cause problems!

 

My party:

 

Human Sorcerer

Half-Orc Barbarian (using two-handed weapons)

Avenger

Monk

 

I went with Monk because I decided I dont want a character who can pickpocket, because stealing from stores is soooo powerful in early game, I thought this would be more challenging.

 

I install all the difficulty-enhancing parts of SCS2, except I don't move Vecna or Vailors to ToB (though I did remove Shield of Balduran and remove SoM invisbility), I also installed that component that makes creatures highest possible challenge level spawn except liches... I have no desire to fight liches upon liches in every undead area...!

 

Should be interesting! Thanks to all who help and double thanks to the makers of these mods!!!

[DrAzTiK]

good luck,

 

Personnaly, I prefer play with more characters but less powerfull items/kits/XP etc...

[Demivrgvs]

Question: If I use Spell Revisions or Refinements, will the SCS2 enemies also have those same abilities, or will they have the original ones?

The original ones. Sorry, I'm not that clever!

Well, it's partially true...for what concerns SR's spells the ones you'll be using are exactly the ones used by the AI. What DavidW says is that he didn't take into account SR changes when selecting spells to assign to opponents, and thus spells which were useless in vanilla are still considered useless by SCS even if SR improves them.

 

Personnaly, I prefer play with more characters but less powerfull items/kits/XP etc...

I do agree.