About enemy THAC0 and AC

[Guest mongerman]

Just curious, is it ever possible to reach a low enough AC that even TOB enemies have a hard time hitting you?

 

Reason I'm asking, is that I'm thinking of creating a low maintanence tank for my new SCSII game. The most obvious answer of course would be a berserker with full plate armor, shield, and stacking magical rings and amulets etc etc.

 

From previous experience, this would work out quite well in SOA, with most enemies requiring a high roll to hit you. But what about TOB?

 

Alternatives would be a swashbuckler, but he would require UAI to be able to wear plate, so his AC would be lacking for quite awhile

 

Finally, for a thieving tank, should I go swashbuckler10>fighter or berserker9>thief?

[DavidW]

Well, let's look at a few case studies. (These are from a full install of SCSII, but not all the creatures are modified by SCSII)

 

(1) Tahazzar, the Baalor in the WK maze, has THAC0 4 and STR 21, giving him an effective THAC0 of zero. If we define "have a hard time hitting you" as "hit you 25% of the time or less", you'd need AC -15.

 

(2) Xei Win Toh, one of the guardians of the Final Seal, has THAC0 1, STR 21, and is double-specialised with her sword +4. So she has (I think) an effective THAC0 of -9, and you'd need AC -25.

 

(3) Elite fire giants have THAC0 2, STR 23, are double-specialised with their battleaxes +3, and are likely to go berserk, gaining an additional +2 to hit. So their effective THAC0 is -10, and you'd need AC -26.

 

(4) The lizard men warriors from Abazigal's Lair have THAC0 1, STR 18/70, and are quadruple-specialised with their halberds +2. So their effective thaco is -5, and you'd need AC -21.

 

(5) Brimstone, the SCSII-added red dragon (who's basically a clone of Firkraag) has THACO -5 and STR 25, for an effective THAC0 of -12. You'd need AC -28 to avoid being hit by him 75% of the time.

 

(6) Anadramatis, the yellow dragon in Abazigal's Lair has THAC0 -8 and STR 25. His effective THAC0 is -15, so you'd need a challenging AC -31 to avoid his attacks 75% of the time.

 

(7) The drow Kensai flunkies who work for Sendai (in the final battle with her) are triple-speicalised with their katanas +3, have STR 16, THAC0 9, and an unexplained +4 to hit (blame the vanilla game). Their effective THAC0 is -1; AC -17 keeps you ahead of them.

 

(8) Abazigal (Ascension version) has THAC0 -8, an unexplained +6 to hit, STR 25, and is quadruple-specialised with his +5 sword. That adds up to an effective THAC0 of -28, so you'll need AC -44 to avoid three quarters of his hits. That's in human form, of course. In transformed form, he's actually a lot easier to stay ahead of: THAC0 -6 and STR 25, for an effective THAC0 of -13.

 

Any help? (None of this, of course, allows for buffs of various kinds - or for Critical Strike, which makes THAC0 moot.)

[Guest mongerman]

Wow, that was a really really big help! Now, I can just create a character and SK in all AC boosting items and see if he can hit the critical AC. Thanks!

[Wisp]

Unless I'm mistaken, there's also an AC cap somewhere. I think it's -26.

[Guest mongerman]

When I played IA, the AC cap on the character screen was -26, but the actual value was reflected in the to-hit rolls

[Icendoan]

Ah, that is base AC. Any other AC modifiers (such as vs one damage type) can go further and therefore allow -31 and other such phenomenal values.

 

I think, anyway.

 

Icen

[Guest mongerman]

Created a custom character and tested it out on illasera. Character had -24 AC on character screen, but Illasera had a bonus of +22! From what I can tell from the attack rolls, it seems -24 is the cap though. She was hitting me on rolls of 6, when I'm sure my AC is actually -30

[Ardanis]

AC cap is -20, not counting DEX and Single Weapon Style. Bonuses against certain damage type stack with normal AC and aren't capped.

[Guest mongerman]

I did some further testing myself, and it seems AC is capped. On the character screen, my AC was -24. Stacked on more items to give -29, which does not show. However, elite fire giants were still hitting on rolls of 25. So it seems XP is capped at -24

[Icendoan]

You can get -26 to show, however.

 

I am pretty sure that the vs Blunt AC modifiers would still work past -24.

 

Icen

[Guest mongerman]

On a related note, does anyone know the lowest enemy AC in the game?