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Demivrgvs

BG1/BGEE Items

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Amulet of Health

+10 might be a little bit too much. +6 maybe?

 

Heart of Golem

This thing is supposed to be heavy, not fitting throwing dagger I guess. But there's nothing special that would fit it lore-wise, so we could find other throwing dagger.

 

Kazgaroth

Same. These items are like... whatever. Nobody's gonna miss them. Ever.

 

Moonblade

Usually they provided high Magic Resistance but we already have Viconia for that. Both of your suggestions sound really cool though.

 

BG: EE items

They are truly hopeless and I even doubt they have any kind of lore.

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Just thought I'd add on this compiled list of all (new) magical items in BG:EE. Most of it is redundant in this thread, but just in case it might come in handy. :)

Thanks man, I already had all those infos from various sources but that list is compiled in a very good format.

 

The real problem when it comes to BGEE stuff is that those items don't have their own unique bams/icons, and generally come with lame 1 line lore/backgrounds. I do have in mind what to do with almost all of them but without those two things they really do not have the minimum requirements to reach IR's standards. :(

 

 

I would like to see an option, which remove those unsuitable items from BG:EE, on the installation of IR if you could add this without consuming lots of time. :)

 

+1 Why bother with all theses stupid new items.

Edited by DrAzTiK

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Moonblade

I would gladly re-discuss its other abilities (e.g. replace the boooring fire res with something a bit more unique like a Spellblade orSpellstoring effect). On a side note, is it just me or +3 enchantment is kinda crazy for BG1?

 

Spellblade - I think we're essentially limited to Magic Missile and Acid/Flame Arrow here. Worth to note that he's a mage, so he won't be generally targeted by those due to spell protections.

Spell Storing - extra incentive to go melee, which is good by me. But we can't do it per PnP without activating dialog mode.

+3 should be fine, as long as it's Xan only.

 

With all the SWTOR stuff going on, I think a throwing Moonblade would be cool - after all, everyone's melee THAC0 is horrible in BG1, and a throwing dagger is more useful for a mage than a melee weapon.

No throwing Moonblades, please!

And welcome to IR btw, didn't know you you've been reading the forum :)

 

BGEE items

Unlike BG2, BG1 is not over-saturated with magical equipment, thus extra items are not so bad there. New icons might be a challenge though, I'm not quite willing to spend several hours per one.

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Amulet of Health

+10 might be a little bit too much. +6 maybe?

I don't know myself, nothing prevent us from tweaking the value after some playtesting. I also thought about using a % increase to make it more unique, but that is hard to balance too (e.g. a 10% bonus is kinda useless in BG1, but a higher % may be too much for BG2).

 

Heart of Golem

This thing is supposed to be heavy, not fitting throwing dagger I guess. But there's nothing special that would fit it lore-wise, so we could find other throwing dagger.

It's as light as any other dagger, and its lore doesn't necessarily suggest a heavy blade imo. I know a throwing dagger isn't particularly unique or cool, but there already are TONS of magical daggers (especially within BG1 where many weapon types barely have 1 unique specimen, and only a few have 2), I kinda exhausted all my ideas. At least you had no returning dagger within BG1, making it relatively unique and extremely convenient addition despite the uninspiring concept (even more so considering the classes who generally pick this proficiency, and BG1 tendency to favor ranged combat).

Moonblade

A +3 longsword would be very powerful... if it were in the hands of someone who wasn't an enchanter...

I know he is a mage, but I also know that it's extremely popular to switch him to F/M (I would do the same myself). Even if I should not give the latter for granted, in the hands of a F/M it's kinda OP within BG1 imo.

 

Usually they provided high Magic Resistance but we already have Viconia for that. Both of your suggestions sound really cool though.

I'm not aware of mr being common, here you can get an idea of the common Moonblade powers.

 

No throwing Moonblades, please!

Ehm...yeah, it looks kinda silly imo. Sorry. :)

 

Spellblade - I think we're essentially limited to Magic Missile and Acid/Flame Arrow here. Worth to note that he's a mage, so he won't be generally targeted by those due to spell protections.

Or we could go crazy and pick Dispel Magic. LOL A new "Edwin" rises! :D

 

Spell Storing - extra incentive to go melee, which is good by me. But we can't do it per PnP without activating dialog mode.

+3 should be fine, as long as it's Xan only.

Well, we could just offer 2-3 options (e.g. Hold Person and/or Vampiric Touch, and/or?), and make it work as an x/day ability which temporarily creates a magical weapon (a copy of the Moonblade with the added cast spell on hit feature) which is removed after the first successful hit.

 

Thought I admit it's a lot of work, and in the end it's not much different than adding to it a standard combat ability.

BG: EE items

They are truly hopeless and I even doubt they have any kind of lore.

Yes, almost all of them have pretty much no lore, or an extremely lame 1 line background.

 

Unlike BG2, BG1 is not over-saturated with magical equipment, thus extra items are not so bad there.

I partially agree, but except few cases (e.g. we needed magical clubs and flails) the new items are kinda redundant even for BG1 (e.g. Golden Axe and Bala's Axe? A Buckler with +1 CON when you already had one with +1 DEX and no medium shield? etc.), and even more so with IR (e.g. I already added a magical returning axe, and the new Sling of Unerring Accuracy is identical to IR's Sling of Seeking).

 

New icons might be a challenge though, I'm not quite willing to spend several hours per one.

That's the real problem, without those (which are mandatory for IR imo) I'm tempted to agree with those players asking for a component to remove all those items when IR is installed.

 

@Arda, what do you think about it? Maybe as a temporary solution? Many of those items can be replaced by existing items very easily. In a certain sense it could be part of Store Revision.

Edited by Demivrgvs

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I have a bit of feedback (love the ideas being put forth at the moment), but I thought I'd just throw this into the mix:

The Worlds Edge (linky)

It's a +3 Two Handed Sword with lore and a description as unique. No powers though, and untouched by IR. This is in our (well, IR's:)) realm right?

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Random rant -

 

Amulet of health - +10 HP is fine. I wouldn't even consider using it otherwise. It's costly.

Xan - +3 is fine imo for his sword. 7 con enchanter...when I last played him, the most valuable thing about Moonblade is 50% Fire resistance. In BG1, there isn't a single enemy which requires more than +1 anyway.

Heart of the Golem - +1 throwing is fine by me - throwing daggers are heavy, so having at least one specimen which is "returning" is nice

World's Edge - agree with Dakk - this should be made unique, rather than generic +3.

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World's Edge

Within vanilla and BGEE this greatsword uses sw2h07.itm filename, which was turned into BG2's Harbinger. IR's most recent take on this weapon turned it into an anti-demon tool, which is kinda fitting for its BG1location too imo (though it may need a small nerf for BG1).

 

That being said, Tutu and BGT use different filenames for this weapon (_sw2h07 and bgsw2h07 respectively) effectively restoring its pre-BG2 version. Mike already asked me to work on this weapon, though I'm reluctant to do so because I would have to find a new bam/icon for it as well as something unique to make it stand out (kinda hard considering we already have tons of greatswords).

 

@Mike, I forgot to ask, am I wrong assuming that within BGEE you get Harbinger while within BGT you get World's Edge?

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This is probably a stupid question.. but why can't IR accommodate the different file names in a BGT install and provide Harbinger?

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This is probably a stupid question.. but why can't IR accommodate the different file names in a BGT install and provide Harbinger?

It can... the thing is, which item should the BG1 part give ? (in all the versions... Tutu, BGT and in BG1EE) Ah, make sure that you accommodate the fact that I will definitely disagree with a brilliant counter argument, and find that now you are arguing with yourself... bye bye.

 

World's Edge

@Mike, I forgot to ask, am I wrong assuming that within BGEE you get Harbinger while within BGT you get World's Edge?

The fact is, that the sw2h07.itm, and sw2h07a.itm in BG1EE v1.2 are the World's Edge, each with the exact same effects etc. Edited by Jarno Mikkola

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This is probably a stupid question.. but why can't IR accommodate the different file names in a BGT install and provide Harbinger?

It can... the thing is, which item should the BG1 part give ? (in all the versions... Tutu, BGT and in BG1EE) Ah, make sure that you accommodate the fact that I will definitely disagree with a brilliant counter argument, and find that now you are arguing with yourself... bye bye.

No self-arguing needed, Harbinger will be fine in BG1 :p

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No self-arguing needed, Harbinger will be fine in BG1 :p

Ah, another one of those not so well possessed by the spirits of CHAOS !

Ruins, riddles and rivets. If you go on and replace all the items in the three editions. Consider the- why ?

The only connection with the BG1 and BG2 weapons have is that the one got replaced with the other in the other game as they wanted to save code space, or they didn't want to recompile the first beta product yet again ! So now you are actually replacing it in the other games too, while ALL the BG1 Total Conversions made it intentionally to be different from the BG2 game ! I ask again- WHY ? The TCs include an official sold game, so they are not just one nerdy product made by a lesser demon of the outer sphere. THINK on it for ones in you life.

Edited by Jarno Mikkola

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Moonblade

I know he is a mage, but I also know that it's extremely popular to switch him to F/M (I would do the same myself).

 

I'm not sure if that's in accordance with his character. Either way F/Ms are quite lame in BG1, a +3 weapon merely compensates his non-existant physical stats.

 

Or we could go crazy and pick Dispel Magic. LOL A new "Edwin" rises! :D

 

Frankly, I don't think an F/M Xan with +3 sword and immunity to Dispel Magic would be remotely close to Edwin.

 

BG: EE items

@Arda, what do you think about it? Maybe as a temporary solution? Many of those items can be replaced by existing items very easily. In a certain sense it could be part of Store Revision.

 

I can do it if there's a popular demand.

 

 

No self-arguing needed, Harbinger will be fine in BG1 :p

Ah, another one of those not so well possessed by the spirits of CHAOS !
Ruins, riddles and rivets. If you go on and replace all the items in the three editions. Consider the- why ?
The only connection with the BG1 and BG2 weapons have is that the one got replaced with the other in the other game as they wanted to save code space, or they didn't want to recompile the first beta product yet again ! So now you are actually replacing it in the other games too, while ALL the BG1 Total Conversions made it intentionally to be different from the BG2 game ! I ask again- WHY ? The TCs include an official sold game, so they are not just one nerdy product made by a lesser demon of the outer sphere. THINK on it for ones in you life.

I did some thinking, but i nonetheless don't see what your problem is.

Edited by Ardanis

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Frankly, I don't think an F/M Xan with +3 sword and immunity to Dispel Magic would be remotely close to Edwin.

This all goes to party choices... I myself take the Ranger+Invoker every time I am good aligned, which is pretty much always. Edwin would go well with the Evil, while Xan could go with Neutral:

Neutral party:

Khalid (who) is Fighter

Jaheira is Druid/Fighter Khalid being Neutral Good kinda ruins this copple

Branwen is Cleric

Faldorn is Druid

Garrick is Bard

Quayle is Illusionist/Cleric

Xan is Enchanter or F/M

Skie is Thief

Neera *EE is Wildmage

Safana is Thief

Is there room for the F/M ? Yes, in case you forgot, the primary alignment(Good, Neutral, Evil) is the one that determines what the mood of the character. You can go with a mix match, but there could be fights and other dooming factors.

Xan: We're all doomed.

 

I did some thinking, but i nonetheless don't see what your problem is.

With that result, I am not a sure there was an argument even pretended to be made. As in, it didn't produce any arguments, except(this is just a throw of what it could be); ?? Wh- ?? My opinion is to go with the vanilla BG2's items with the changes made by the IR, as everything else is heresy. :D

My point was, the BG1 item was never in BG2, it could be just a coincidence that the Harbinger replaced the World's Edge, or an intern picked up the .itm editing tool and looked at stuff and made a mess of one of the original games items when he was assigned to design an item.

Edited by Jarno Mikkola

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.......

I agree with everything hearby said.

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World's Edge

Within vanilla and BGEE this greatsword uses sw2h07.itm filename, which was turned into BG2's Harbinger. IR's most recent take on this weapon turned it into an anti-demon tool, which is kinda fitting for its BG1location too imo (though it may need a small nerf for BG1).

 

That being said, Tutu and BGT use different filenames for this weapon (_sw2h07 and bgsw2h07 respectively) effectively restoring its pre-BG2 version. Mike already asked me to work on this weapon, though I'm reluctant to do so because I would have to find a new bam/icon for it as well as something unique to make it stand out (kinda hard considering we already have tons of greatswords).

 

@Mike, I forgot to ask, am I wrong assuming that within BGEE you get Harbinger while within BGT you get World's Edge?

 

  1. World's Edge artwork is unique (see Dakk's link).
  2. Vanilla BGEE and Tutu have World's Edge. BGT has World's Edge AND Harbinger. (The beta IR unintentionally replaces World's Edge with Harbinger in BGEE, but that is easily fixed.)

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