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K4thos

concept for a new BP-BGT Worldmap style mod

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I think a 'no cloth filter' option is what I'd prefer too. This particular filter K4thos used distorts the map too much, IMHO.

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@Istfemer This is just my uninformed opinion based purely on looks:

I like most of it, especially the SoD areas look really well placed but I think some BG1 areas look weird on the map.

Fire Leaf Forest, Nashkel Mines and Wilderness Lake look really weird placed right into the mountains like that.

I'm not sure anything should be separated by those mountains (again, based just on how it looks). I think Gibberling Mountains and Cloud Peaks should be the ones at the nothern edge of the mountains with everything else farther north (except for Heretic Temple, which should be right in the middle of the mountains.)

Also, Wyrm's Crossing is really far from Baldur's Gate but I think that's been an issue with the old map as well.

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Ok ... I think I understand now what's going on 🙄

I wasn't clear on the distinction between the BP-BGT world map and the default EET map. In each one of my EET installs, I was disappointed with the map because I had selected the BP-BGT map at install. I was left to wonder why I wasn't seeing that beautiful map that I now know is the default EET map. đŸ€”

Topological accuracy notwithstanding (all respect to @Istfemer), I find the default EET map far more aesthetically appealing than the BP-BGT map -- in either the original or proposed form. I will be using the default. Since I am not likely to be a user of the BP-BGT map mod, please feel free to file my various opinions in this thread into the trashcan 😛

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@Lightbringer Well, the default EET map is definitely more compact than this map or the old BP-BGT map. It also reuses much of the original artwork from SoA's & ToB's maps, which is very nice. Is that why you like it better?

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Can't speak for @Lightbringer of course but the BP-BGT map is pretty overwhlemingly big that combined with the more visually pleasing EET map might be the reason. At least I feel that way.

Now, getting rid of that cloth filter may go a long way in changing that...

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@Ulb The Sword Coast south of Baldur's Gate is, unfortunately, a very crowded place area-wise. Still, there *is* potential for improvement in this region. If I'm able to spare time, I'll review BG1EE areas as well. I can already see a few areas that are certainly in dire need of repositioning.

In hindsight, I probably should've moved Heretic Temple a bit further NW, into the southeasternmost Cloudpeak Mountains. That is, into the proper mountains and not the foothills. For some reason I didn't do it. (?maybe because I felt that placement didn't fit the local area map well?)

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Posted (edited)

sure, no problem with releasing more map art variants or using base image, if that option is more popular. I've chosen clothify filter for this showcase since on grainy image differences between different icon art styles seems less prominent.

Also if some artist would like to adjust the colors or work further with the base image, PM me.

1 hour ago, Ulb said:

Fire Leaf Forest, Nashkel Mines and Wilderness Lake look really weird placed right into the mountains like that.

according to the in-game signpost Fire Leaf Forest is in the Cloud Peaks mountain range: 

CiK5ksq.png

also the area is quite rocky and has high probability of snow. On BG:EE worldmap it's located below Nashkeel, which is a town located in northern slopes of the  Cloud Peaks . Wilderness Lake placement is a result of existing links between areas and its position on BG:EE map. Of course I'm ok with further tweaking BG1 areas placement - current one was quite a rush job on my part.

Edited by K4thos

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Ulb said:

Also, Wyrm's Crossing is really far from Baldur's Gate but I think that's been an issue with the old map as well.

One elegant solution would be to shift the rectangle encasing Baldur's Gate City to the east. As it is, the city is placed rather far to the west of its original location, so it's only fair to do so. Ulgoth's Beard should be shifted south in this case.

-----

On a related note:

@K4thos I proposed shifting the rectangle with Athkatla to the north and putting in on top of Alandor river. I'd still like to hear your opinion on this.

Edited by Istfemer

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Posted (edited)

 

19 minutes ago, Istfemer said:

I proposed shifting the rectangle with Athkatla to the north and putting in on top of Alandor river. I'd still like to hear your opinion on this.

fine by me, I will send you xcf file.

1 hour ago, Ulb said:

Also, Wyrm's Crossing is really far from Baldur's Gate but I think that's been an issue with the old map as well.

this is no longer an issue. Beamdog removed BG city walls from Wyrm's Crossing area.

BG1:

NzqyAji.jpg

EE:

2umkSx6.jpg
 

edit: also according to official maps, Wyrm's Crossing is quite far from the city walls (notice that the distance is of similar size as the city itself)

https://prints.mikeschley.com/p996068422/h95973009#h95973009

Edited by K4thos

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Posted (edited)

@K4thos :ohmy: Wow. Why, Beamdog?

Those mighty walls... gone? That's... that's the heist of the century, I'm sure. :rotflmao:

-----

I also see that some trees have been replanted and the paved road has been tampered with (?re-routed?) as well. Hmmm.

Edited by Istfemer

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Have any of you ever looked at the FR Atlas (it comes as a program)?  My understanding is that it is about as cannon as it gets when it comes to terrain and locations of places in Faerûn.

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@Sam. I have. FR Atlas is  a useful source, but it does not cover some regions (like eastern Amn) as well as I hoped it would.

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Posted (edited)

@IstfemerNo knock against your efforts at all. As a worldbuilder myself, I have great respect for your attempts at accuracy.

I think the appeal of the default map -- to me personally -- is multifold.

I like the "painted" look. Something about the softer tones evokes a more fantastic impression -- almost verging on the dreamlike.

I also very much like how full the default map gets. I found EET in the first place from looking for maps for a Forgotten Realms tabletop D&D campaign and finding the default EET map in a Google image search. That map fills me with a sense of excitement over just how many cool places I'll get to go experience all in one game. It dwarfs anything in the vanilla experience of BG1, SoA, ToB, IWD1 or IWD2. Seeing them all together, all at once, in the same map, was almost a religious experience.

I think the larger BP-BGT map just has too much empty space. While actually much more realistic and to scale, it gives more of a "that's it?" sense than a "wow, all that?" sense.  Of course, it's not a completely fair comparison -- the default map includes icons from DSotSC, NTotSC, and TDD, at least.

Pure personal taste. I guess I prefer my illusions xD

Edited by Lightbringer

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Posted (edited)

I have 4 large standalone maps of Faerûn as references before me + the map of FR Interactive Atlas + a few regional maps from lorebooks + a few custom-made regional maps from various online sources. One is dated 1357DR (late 1st edition, I think); two belong to the 2nd edition, one of which is dated 1367DR (which is pretty close to BG1's timeline) and the other one's undated; the fourth belongs to the early 3rd edition and is dated 1372DR (well past the events of ToB).

They're all different! All 5 of them. It is my impression that S.Breit's map (the one we're discussing here) largely uses the 1372DR map as a base, which presents its own set of compatibility challenges for me. For example, the 3e map doesn't depict Kuldin Peaks. Where are they? They're gone. Where are they gone? It's a mystery. Kuldin Peaks simply disappeared without trace one sunny or maybe rainy day. For what I know, they might have sprouted propellers and roared away into the Realmspace.

Anyway, Saradush is NW of Omlarandin Mountains on the three older maps (just as on the map in FR IA) and SW of them on the 3e map (and thus also on S.Breit's map). So which location for Saradush is canon then? Good question.

Edited by Istfemer
typo

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Wow, I never noticed the BG walls are gone from the Wyrm's Crossing map.. baffeling how one can miss such a change. It's a good one though, now the distance between the two areas is indeed no longer an issue!

 

Regarding the BG1 areas, I'm aware that those areas (Nashkel, etc..) are supposedly quite high altitude already (I actually worked on a re-skin of the Nashkel area to reflect that more prominently) Still, especially now with the Heretic Temple area showcasing how 'actually in the middle of the mountains' looks, I think they should be at the foothills of the mountains, not in the middle of it.

 

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