BG2 Fixpack Testers Needed

[Kulyok]

About the BG2 Fixpack I'd question considering the Magically created Weapons to Zero Weight and Make +x/+y Weapons Consistent real fixes...

 

Yes, I quite agree. Five years of playing this way make for the absence of clear developer intent for me here. I am able to see other stuff as fixes/examples of Bioware's sloppiness. These two I do not.

 

I wonder if more people feel this way. It'll be painful for me to play without the Fixpack, that's for sure.

[Grim Squeaker]

Well think about it this way, if Magically created weapons have weight then Melf's Minute Meteors have weight (all 20 of them or however many you have). This means your character is now actually carrying somewhere on his or person 20 small flaming rocks. However without it things makes a lot more sense, as you assume they are summoned to hand when the player is about to throw one.

 

Also, we should probably move this out of the Announcements forum.

[CamDawg]

Yes, I quite agree. Five years of playing this way make for the absence of clear developer intent for me here.

By that logic, we'd fix nothing.

[SimDing0]

Yes, I quite agree. Five years of playing this way make for the absence of clear developer intent for me here.

Let me tell a story.

 

Back when I was 12 or 13, I used to play BG1. I especially enjoyed Durlag's Tower, which to this day is my favourite IE dungeon. Each time I played, I encountered the villainous "demonknight". I told myself that it was a creature so fearsome and magical that its name defied the normal rules of grammar. This explanation settled, and I came to accept it as part of the game.

 

It later occured to me that it was probably a bug.

[Kulyok]

Well, I cannot see how twenty magical flaming rocks would weigh nothing. In other cases, I see developer intent: if quest keys disappear in some doors, they might as well disappear in others; if grammar is not correct somewhere, it's not right; and many other ifs. Here it is not so obvious, so I would hesitate to include it in no-choice package.

[Grim Squeaker]

Well, I cannot see how twenty magical flaming rocks would weigh nothing

 

My point was that they'd probably be summoned to hand as you need them, as opposed to sitting in your backpack waiting to be used (and burning a hole in your bag). However if they weigh something the situation has to be the latter.

[Salk]

Well...I think it is the case to think of which school a specific spell belongs to. It often indicates if a spell has reasons to create something that has or not a weight.

[NiGHTMARE]

Well, I cannot see how twenty magical flaming rocks would weigh nothing.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Why should twenty magical flaming rocks weigh anything when twenty non-magical, non-flaming rocks (not to mention arrows and bolts) don't weigh anything?

[Salk]

You have a point in that Nightmare. I had asked Echon to set a weight for arrows, bolts and stones in his FotD because having them weigh nothing disturbed my logic. Unfortunately the minimum weight would be 1 for each arrow thus couldn't be done...

[Kulyok]

My point was that they'd probably be summoned to hand as you need them, as opposed to sitting in your backpack waiting to be used (and burning a hole in your bag). However if they weigh something the situation has to be the latter.

 

Quite! I was thinking the same lines. But I think more this way now: weapons that are "Permanent", like Melf's Minute Meteors or Jan's inventions, have weight. But "Temporary" weapons, that disappear after a minute, like Energy blades, do not have weight. And this seems logical to me.

 

As for burning holes, well - Minsc carrying sixteen full plate armors doesn't seem exactly logical to me, either, and many quest items are "icky" this way. C'est le jeu.

 

(Answering NiGHTMARE, arrows and rocks probably don't have weight, because in game mechanics, they are not weapons - they are charges. But that's just guesswork, really. If an average rock is 50-60g, then 20 of them are well over a pound - which is indeed an inconsistency.)

 

 

Melf's Minute Meteors: So. Maybe "Si non confectus, non reficiat (If it ain't broke, don't fix it) works in this particular case?

[Drew]

Unless you are applying "Si non confectus, non reficat" to the way that the fix pack handles the issue currently, I'd have to disagree. 20 burning rocks will burn a rather substantial hole in one's backpack, ammo case, or quiver and, unless the caster is a juggler (and a damn good one), there's no way in hell he's holding all 20 in his hands. The only remotely logical conclusion remaining is that one comes to the casters hand as the other is thrown.

[cirerrek]

I actually like the magically created weapons weigh nothing component, but I've got to admit that swinging a 0 weight = 0 mass = 0 moment of inertia sword would be an awfully odd feeling. But hey! It's magic, so I guess I'll let it slide

[Grim Squeaker]

I actually like the magically created weapons weigh nothing component, but I've got to admit that swinging a 0 weight = 0 mass = 0 moment of inertia sword would be an awfully odd feeling.  But hey!  It's magic, so I guess I'll let it slide 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Well, obviously it has to have some weight, but just very, very, very little.

[Guest Oversight components optional?]

When the fixpack is released, could the Oversight components be optional? I don't like bending DnD's rules too much, and I think Oversight goes against the rules too often.

 

Or will all the fixes be modular?

[Andyr]

Only the Oversight fixes (and not the tweaks) will be included in the Fixpack--so nothing which bends the rules.