Suggestion: Barbarian back to separate class

[testlum]

The barbarian was originally a standalone class in Baldur's Gate, prior to the Enhanced Editions. The Barbarian's existing description still matches the formatting for a class and not a kit too.

I thought it was changed to Fighter due to a technical limitation for the number of classes and wanting to add the Shaman. Apparently that's not the case since the Blackguard could be made standalone in Talents of Faerun along with the addition of Favored Soul.

Since I also noticed a number of Barbarian-only abilities in the Fighter HLA list, I suggest reverting the Barbarian back to being its standalone class and not a kit.

[DavidW]

This is an interesting case study.

Classes are hard-coded. ToF can't actually introduce new classes at the engine level. What's happening is that the UI is lying to you (it does this a lot in ToF), presenting as a class something that's actually a kit. (Favored Soul is actually a collection of Shaman kits, as far as the engine is concerned, but the UI systematically conceals this from you.)

It would be very easy to do the same thing for Barbarians. It wouldn't actually change anything - you wouldn't notice a difference except cosmetically. I think at one point I was going to do it - and also create some Barbarian kits (more lies) just to show how it works - but I ran out of time.

I might put this in (not with the extra kits) into the next release. In the meantime, if you want to do it yourself:

- open dw_talents/test/test.tpa in a text editor, and edit it to be

DEFINE_ACTION_FUNCTION test STR_VAR version=0 BEGIN

	LAF 2da_read STR_VAR file=clastext.2da RET_ARRAY clastext_array=array END
	OUTER_SET name_strref=$clastext_array("BARBARIAN" "MIXED")
	OUTER_SET desc_strref=$clastext_array("BARBARIAN" "DESCSTR")

	LAF 2da_read STR_VAR file=clsrcreq.2da case=lower RET_ARRAY clsrcreq_array=array END
	ACTION_FOR_EACH column IN human elf dwarf gnome halfling half_elf halforc BEGIN
		OUTER_SET "%column%"=$clsrcreq_array("barbarian" "%column%")
	END
	
	LAF add_virtual_class INT_VAR name_strref desc_strref STR_VAR parent=fighter ident=class_barbarian human elf dwarf gnome halfling half_elf halforc all_races="false" END
	LAF assign_kit_to_virtual_class STR_VAR kit=barbarian class=class_barbarian END


END

- open dw_talents/dw_talents.tp2 in a text editor, and add a new component, something like

BEGIN "Barbarian as class" DESIGNATED 0 

LAF run STR_VAR file=test location=test END

- Install the new component.

Incidentally, the oBG2 UI is also lying to you - in the oBG2 engine, Barbarian is a kit, not a class.

[subtledoctor]

1 hour ago, testlum said:

The barbarian was originally a standalone class in Baldur's Gate,

This is technically not true. The Barbarian was always a kit in the fighter class under the hood. It was bound by fighter rules for proficiencies, item usability, etc. It only appeared as a distinct class due to a proto-UI hack by Bioware. The EE games just made it appear as it was always coded: as a kit. (Also, in 2E AD&D the Barbarian was in fact a fighter kit before it was broken out later as a subclass. So the EE way is true to the source material. For whatever that is worth!)

[testlum]

That's interesting to know. I've skimmed the AD&D 2e Handbook for Barbarians and it includes a number of kits including the Wizard Slayer. A kit of a kit!

[subtledoctor]

4 hours ago, testlum said:

That's interesting to know. I've skimmed the AD&D 2e Handbook for Barbarians and it includes a number of kits including the Wizard Slayer. A kit of a kit!

Before the Barbarian's Handbook was a thing, Barbarians were a kit in the very first "Complete" brown-cover handbook: PHBR1, the Complete Fighter's Handbook.

In fact Barbarians, Cavaliers, and Swashbucklers were all originally fighter kits! Then later they migrated to a distinct subclass, a paladin kit, and a thief kit, respectively.

[polytope]

On 12/14/2023 at 8:16 AM, subtledoctor said:

This is technically not true. The Barbarian was always a kit in the fighter class under the hood. It was bound by fighter rules for proficiencies, item usability, etc. It only appeared as a distinct class due to a proto-UI hack by Bioware.

And a few hardcoded features in the original BG2; backstab immunity and 12 sided hit dice. Originally monks were a bit the same, with a mixture of abilities granted by CLAB and hardcoded.