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A stupid question or a bug? (35.17 BG2EE SoA)


Guest monsieur

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Guest monsieur

Is it normal that when you start a new game that the player characters bhaalspawn special abilties are completely random? When I started with a berserker main character I had 2x vampiric touch, 2x horror, 2x larlochs minor drain and of course 2x enrage. Last time I played a couple of years ago I remember that they were completely different. Next I made a generic fighter and started a new game and this time they were 2x draw upon holy might, 2x slow poison, 2x cure light wounds. Each time I start a new game the special abilites are different. I'm one of those who never played the non-enhanced editions and this is only my second time using any mods so I'm not that experienced. So is this just a normal part of the game that I never paid attention to mods or no mods, or is this a delibirate change by a mod or is it a bug?

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Posted (edited)

Normal, but it's not entirely random. When you start a new game in SoA, the Bhaalspawn abilities are chosen based on the protagonist's alignment. There's some randomness in the EE, but good characters will tend to get the good abilities and evil characters the evil abilities. (This is a difference between the EE and the original game; original BG2 chose the abilities deterministically based on a 2DA file.)

SCS does not affect this at all.

Edited by jmerry
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35 minutes ago, jmerry said:

original BG2 chose the abilities deterministically based on a 2DA file.

First you got ninjaed, and then you couldn't look up the name of the .2da file. Well, here it is, and linked: abstart.2da
And I could be wrong, but I still don't think it's random at all. In BG1, the abilities depended on the alignment score(or reputation) you had at the time the chapter dream happened, which wasn't random, but your score could of course go up and dip and dive depending on what you did which could make it look like it was RANDOM, which it wasn't.

Edited by Jarno Mikkola
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I did look it up; I just didn't post it. And I tested it a few times; a newly created NG character spawned with all good abilities one time and one evil ability another time. There is definite randomness, though I can't provide any hard numbers.

Characters that are imported from BG1/BGEE will not have their abilities randomized, of course; they'll have whatever they picked up back then, which is deterministic based on reputation at the time the abilities are gained.

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1 hour ago, argent77 said:

Bhaalspawn abilities are somewhat randomized by the engine when you start a new character in BG2. Bubb reverse-engineered the exact odds a while ago when I implemented it for EET.

The actual probabilities are outlined here: https://github.com/Gibberlings3/EET/blob/master/EET/lib/bhaalspawn_abilities.tpa#L24-L37

Erhm, problem I keep hearing is, this: https://github.com/Gibberlings3/EET/blob/master/EET/lib/bhaalspawn_abilities.tpa#L217 is not actually 50% vs 50%, but far from it, as the response is recalculated with every iteration it goes through, and as it has no natural total of 100, it slips to be more probable for the first than 50%.

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"Random" is a far more general term than you seem to think it is. Neither I nor argent77 ever said that the probabilities followed a uniform distribution. What we are saying, and what randomness means in this case, is that if you create a character in SoA that's anything other than LG or CE, their Bhaalspawn abilities won't necessarily be the same every time you make that character.

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52 minutes ago, Jarno Mikkola said:

Erhm, problem I keep hearing is, this: https://github.com/Gibberlings3/EET/blob/master/EET/lib/bhaalspawn_abilities.tpa#L217 is not actually 50% vs 50%, but far from it, as the response is recalculated with every iteration it goes through, and as it has no natural total of 100, it slips to be more probable for the first than 50%.

I can't confirm your claim. In my tests the RESPONSE probabilities were calculated independently for every script block, even if they use Continue(). They were also (more or less) evenly distributed without favoring a specific RESPONSE block.

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Guest monsieur

Thanks for all the answers. My berserker was indeed chaotic neutral and the generic fighter was that Abdel from character files and he is lawful or neutral good and that meant he had completely different abilities. Good to know there is also some randomness involved and that the actual probabilities have also been figured out. You learn something new every time you play this game.

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