Removing BG1 profs

[Nythrun]

It certainly would make sense if nothing had changed in the implementation of BG1 profs in BG2, and I'm happy to take your word for it that most of them do work that way

 

How is this possible on core, though?

 

 

[devSin]

I don't know that Bodhi is even legit (she has a luck bonus, and who knows what else she gets bonuses from).

 

When I checked, the proficiencies only applied when the category was correct (I even gave Abdel the black dragon main-hand weapon); the proficiency value from the item didn't affect the THAC0 bonus. It's always possible that they have some hack in there to give bonuses to NPCs, but I didn't want to spend too much time on it (it already took forever to modify the profs in the GAM and reload, rinse, repeat for each category!). Try giving Bodhi a long sword (category == 20) and see if her THAC0 improves.

 

If you find different behaviors, post post post! I don't want to be right; I want the truth.

[devSin]

I needed to check something else, so I went ahead and looked at this. My Bodhi (CreateCreature("BODHI")) had a +11 to hit (sorry, Imoen); changing the VAMP category to long swords, she got the extra +2 THAC0 for grand mastery (defined in WSPECIAL) for a total of +13 to hit.

[Nythrun]

If you find different behaviors, post post post! I don't want to be right; I want the truth.

 

I'm not really sure I'm finding different behaviors, just a few things that resist explanation I'm just glad that BG1 proficiencies still work in other people's games as well as mine and that I'm not just having some crazy-time here.

 

After a rushed and desultory bit of testing today:

 

BG1 profs check item type, not the proficiency field, yep. They don't stack with the BG2 profs: if an item's eligable for both kinds and its wielder has both kinds, the engine uses the better of the two values (tested with a plain quarterstaff and Blunts (no pot jokes please!))

 

If poor Imoen was unarmed when you sicked Bodhi on her, you'd match the to-hit bonus I had (+7, plus an additional four for target without melee weapon). So that's all good, except...

 

Bohdi has only 24 strength (+6 to hit) and I don't see a luck bonus in ring95, helmnoan, vampreg2, immune2, minhp1, or bohdi.itm (nor in the s2-16 she's carrying that's not assigned) nor in her scripting. So her bonus to hit is better than it should be and she sometimes hits too hard. I'd thought this was from her proficiencies, but an extra +1 doesn't match wspecial.2da. It's not in the proficiency, well enough - but what then ? I did check if there was an undocumented to-hit bonus versus opponents with nothing in the armor slot, and there isn't. I'd initially checked this with Firkraag, who also hits too hard, but it's possible I'd not checked the difficulty setting that time, and I'm too busy at the moment to again test Old Yeller's Redder's damage until several 18s come up on 3d6.

 

One of the morals of this story:

 

Don't spend three weeks writing a six thousand line .tp2 to intelligently assign BG2 style profs to non-joinable NPCs. BG1 profs are safe to use and adequate.

 

Just don't get rid of them

[devSin]

Bodhi's luck bonus is in her CRE file. There's two lucks in the engine; the creature stat (stored just above the old-style proficiencies), and the non-cumulative luck spell effect (the hard-coded luck modifiers for intoxication, fatigue, whatever, use the creature stat value).

 

Bodhi's hits will always be +1 thanks to that luck bonus. IIRC, some creatures have insane luck (coughFamCat25cough). Bodhi also has 100 tracking, but thankfully, that was never implemented (not that it would have helped her, I guess).

 

In any case, it's always encouraging to learn that BioWare may not have been so careless after all.

[Nythrun]

In any case, it's always encouraging to learn that BioWare may not have been so careless after all.

 

Not careless, just masters of corner cutting It is after all the only way to convert squares to circles with ruler and compass.

 

I'd thought that stat wasn't used (you're talking about the byte at 6ch or 6dh or whatever, right?) so that would sort the thac0 (not the damage though, luck's just a probability shift there and not a proper bonus).

[devSin]

Yeah, that's it. It works fine. The non-cumulative effect is only for the spell. It grants at the very least an equivalent bonus to THAC0 (IIRC, not reflected on the character sheet of course).

[pro5]

Yeah, that's it. It works fine. The non-cumulative effect is only for the spell. It grants at the very least an equivalent bonus to THAC0 (IIRC, not reflected on the character sheet of course).

 

I think it gives a bonus to all dice rolls (tohit, damage and saves).