SR + aVENGER's Revised Fiends

[Demivrgvs]

I'm not sure whether this is intended or not, but Spell Revisions currently removes RINGDEMN.ITM from DEMGLASU.CRE and DEMPITSU.CRE. This causes some issues with aTweaks' upcoming component as it negates the demons' innate resistances.

It's intended because I didn't wanted SR to mess with non-summoned fiends. I'll try to think about a possible solution.

 

Also, the flickering application of Prot. from Evil 10' radius may slightly disrupt the AI of summoned demons in aTweaks and possibly even in the unmodded game. Basically, there seems to be a split second between two applications of the spell which is sometimes enough for a summoned demon to notice the party.

I cannot look at it right now, but if what you're saying really happens I'm pretty sure I can fix it by making the effect last 7 seconds each round.

[aVENGER_(RR)]

It's intended because I didn't wanted SR to mess with non-summoned fiends. I'll try to think about a possible solution.

 

No worries, I've already handled it with an ACTION_IF block which restores the item in case it's missing.

 

I cannot look at it right now, but if what you're saying really happens I'm pretty sure I can fix it by making the effect last 7 seconds each round.

 

I think that would probably fix it. As noted, the window between two castings is really small but it's enough for aTweaks' Fiend AI to notice the party. If you like, I can hook you up with a beta version so that you can test this more thoroughly.

[Demivrgvs]

It's intended because I didn't wanted SR to mess with non-summoned fiends. I'll try to think about a possible solution.

No worries, I've already handled it with an ACTION_IF block which restores the item in case it's missing.

Cool.

 

In case you haven't looked at it I handle all resistancies and abilities (e.g. glabrezu's permanent true seeing) within the "weapon slot".

 

I cannot look at it right now, but if what you're saying really happens I'm pretty sure I can fix it by making the effect last 7 seconds each round.

I think that would probably fix it. As noted, the window between two castings is really small but it's enough for aTweaks' Fiend AI to notice the party.

Done, I'll include the "fix" in the next hotfix.

 

If you like, I can hook you up with a beta version so that you can test this more thoroughly.

I'm following your progress reports and I'm amazed by the amount of details and features you're implementing, but I really haven't time to test it myself. Sooner or later I'd like to discuss your work to make sure we can make it work flawlessly within a SCS + SR installation, I'll open a small topic about it as soon as I find some time for it.

[aVENGER_(RR)]

In case you haven't looked at it I handle all resistancies and abilities (e.g. glabrezu's permanent true seeing) within the "weapon slot".

 

That shouldn't matter as I set the base resistances directly at the CRE level and replace the Fiends' primary weapons with my own custom ones. All of this is done via interactive patching of course, which takes into account other mods, as well as any unique creatures who might have above average attributes (like the Master of Thralls for example).

 

Sooner or later I'd like to discuss your work to make sure we can make it work flawlessly within a SCS + SR installation, I'll open a small topic about it as soon as I find some time for it.

 

Actually, I'm testing aTweaks' PnP Fiends with Tactics, SCSII and SR right now and it's looking pretty good. I did have to make a couple of dedicated ACTION_IF blocks to resolve some minor issues, but in general, all of the aforementioned mods should work nicely together even on a full scale BWP install.

[Demivrgvs]

Sooner or later I'd like to discuss your work to make sure we can make it work flawlessly within a SCS + SR installation, I'll open a small topic about it as soon as I find some time for it.

Actually, I'm testing aTweaks' PnP Fiends with Tactics, SCSII and SR right now and it's looking pretty good. I did have to make a couple of dedicated ACTION_IF blocks to resolve some minor issues, but in general, all of the aforementioned mods should work nicely together even on a full scale BWP install.

Cool, but still I'd have a couple of things to discuss such as fiends hit points (SCS and SR use values are almost the double; compatibility with SCS's improved staying power), fiends effectiveness, SCS compatibility (when summoned by the AI the fiends should never act against the summoner and his/her allies), SR compatibility (do you update SR's spell descriptions? because I provide complete descriptions in-game and it wouldn't be great if they become incorrect), and so on.

[aVENGER_(RR)]

SCS and SR use values are almost the double; compatibility with SCS's improved staying power)

 

Basically, aTweaks enforces proper PnP values to all non-unique Fiends (i.e. all generic Nabassu and such) as that's what "PnP Fiends advertises. OTOH, unique creatures are allowed to have higher than average values, and aTweaks won't lower them if that's the case, regardless of the source.

 

SCS compatibility (when summoned by the AI the fiends should never act against the summoner and his/her allies)

 

I don't alter Fiends summoned by SCSII casters in any way, neither their AI nor their stats and abilities. That's by design.

 

SR compatibility (do you update SR's spell descriptions? because I provide complete descriptions in-game and it wouldn't be great if they become incorrect)

 

If SR is detected, I revert the mage versions of the Fiend summoning spells (and scrolls) to their vague, unmodded descriptions and patch them to work on aTweaks' per-alignment basis. However, note that this only occurs if the "Revised Fiend Summoning Spells" component is installed, which is separate and completely independent from the "PnP Fiends" component.

[aVENGER_(RR)]

If SR is detected, I revert the mage versions of the Fiend summoning spells (and scrolls) to their vague, unmodded descriptions and patch them to work on aTweaks' per-alignment basis.

 

Actually, scratch that. I just noticed that the default spell descriptions always refer to demons (even when talking about Pit Fiends ) so I'm going to replace them with my own custom descriptions (again, only if the "Revised Fiend Summoning" component is installed).

 

BTW, Demi, you might want to split this into a separate thread as we aren't discussing bugs anymore.

[Demivrgvs]

Basically, aTweaks enforces proper PnP values to all non-unique Fiends (i.e. all generic Nabassu and such) as that's what "PnP Fiends advertises. OTOH, unique creatures are allowed to have higher than average values, and aTweaks won't lower them if that's the case, regardless of the source.

And do SR/SCS fiends count as "unique, more powerful creatures" or are they replaced by your version?

 

SCS compatibility (when summoned by the AI the fiends should never act against the summoner and his/her allies)

I don't alter Fiends summoned by SCSII casters in any way, neither their AI nor their stats and abilities. That's by design.

This may actually answer my previous question...but if I understood correctly I'm a little worried about "consistency". I don't like too much the fact that summoned fiends will be radically different from the others. I suppose that the "Revised Fiend Summoning Spells" component should handle that, right?

 

If that's so I still fear that replacing SCS fiends with yours (even in an optional component) may be problematic, because SCS mages would use the spell without knowing that the fiends can know kick their butt again.

 

I just noticed that the default spell descriptions always refer to demons (even when talking about Pit Fiends ) so I'm going to replace them with my own custom descriptions (again, only if the "Revised Fiend Summoning" component is installed).

Great, I suppose it would be too much to ask you to keep SR's standard template in case SR is detected (for consistency with all the other summoning spells within SR), but I'm suggesting it anyway.

 

BTW, Demi, you might want to split this into a separate thread as we aren't discussing bugs anymore.

Done.

[aVENGER_(RR)]

And do SR/SCS fiends count as "unique, more powerful creatures" or are they replaced by your version

 

Summoned Fiend CREs and Fiend summoning spells are not replaced. They are altered (via patching) but only by the "Revised Fiend Summoning" component. Note that they are not changed at all by the main "PnP Fiends" component.

 

This may actually answer my previous question...but if I understood correctly I'm a little worried about "consistency". I don't like too much the fact that summoned fiends will be radically different from the others. I suppose that the "Revised Fiend Summoning Spells" component should handle that, right?

 

Correct. People who want consistency should install both components. People who want compatibility can skip on either one.

 

If that's so I still fear that replacing SCS fiends with yours (even in an optional component) may be problematic, because SCS mages would use the spell without knowing that the fiends can know kick their butt again.

 

Nope, that's not how it works. I've checked David's code, and he uses his own custom Fiend summoning spells (which are spawned from the originals on the fly). So, if aTweaks is installed after SCSII, then it won't touch David's custom spells nor his summoned creatures.

 

Great, I suppose it would be too much to ask you to keep SR's standard template in case SR is detected (for consistency with all the other summoning spells within SR), but I'm suggesting it anyway.

 

I'm sticking with the standard PnP spell format, sorry. Here's a sample.