Compatibility with Item Upgrade Mod?

[sturmvogel]

Looking over the revised items, I can see some real issues with using Weimer's Item Upgrade mod in combination with IR. Forex Keldorn's Firecam plate upgrades with the Armor of the Hart to give it AC -2, +2 saves, "Firecam free action", immunity to fear and low weight. But the revised Armor of the Hart is arguably better than the upgraded Firecam with since it is AC -3 and has the interesting Heroic Inspiration ability. I'm a little concerned about this since I'd like to see character-specific items usable all the way through TOB, just as a philosophical point (plus I've always hated how common +4 and +5 weapons are, but armor of an equal enchantment is scarcer than hens teeth) and have been contemplating some upgrades for them in TOB. But since I like where you're heading with all this I think that I'll just put them on the back-burner for now.

 

I gather that you'd prefer to settle on the basic items before getting into revising/adding upgradeable items, but I'd be willing to help out whenever you're ready to look at them.

 

At any rate you should probably post a warning that this mod deprecates many of the weapon and armor upgrades from IU. If need be I can tally them up for you.

[Demivrgvs]

At any rate you should probably post a warning that this mod deprecates many of the weapon and armor upgrades from IU. If need be I can tally them up for you.

You're right, I'll add it in the readme as a "conceptual incompatibility".

 

Forex Keldorn's Firecam plate upgrades with the Armor of the Hart to give it AC -2, +2 saves, "Firecam free action", immunity to fear and low weight. But the revised Armor of the Hart is arguably better than the upgraded Firecam with since it is AC -3 and has the interesting Heroic Inspiration ability.

IU's Firecam Improved Armor is actually more powerful than IR's Armor of the Hart.

 

I'm a little concerned about this since I'd like to see character-specific items usable all the way through TOB, just as a philosophical point

That's the main reason for which I may work on upgradeable items in the future.

 

plus I've always hated how common +4 and +5 weapons are, but armor of an equal enchantment is scarcer than hens teeth

Me too, but you may have noticed this is not true anymore with IR installed, though this probably causes unbalancing issues if you don't install "dexterity penalty in heavy armor" component.

[sturmvogel]

Forex Keldorn's Firecam plate upgrades with the Armor of the Hart to give it AC -2, +2 saves, "Firecam free action", immunity to fear and low weight. But the revised Armor of the Hart is arguably better than the upgraded Firecam with since it is AC -3 and has the interesting Heroic Inspiration ability.

IU's Firecam Improved Armor is actually more powerful than IR's Armor of the Hart.

 

I'm a little concerned about this since I'd like to see character-specific items usable all the way through TOB, just as a philosophical point

That's the main reason for which I may work on upgradeable items in the future.

 

plus I've always hated how common +4 and +5 weapons are, but armor of an equal enchantment is scarcer than hens teeth

Me too, but you may have noticed this is not true anymore with IR installed, though this probably causes unbalancing issues if you don't install "dexterity penalty in heavy armor" component.

 

I'm not so sure about IU's Firecam vs. your revised Armor of the Hart since I value the better AC by quite a bit. (I get really tired of Keldorn getting hit while trying to cast his True Sight or dispel something.) I think that a good AC in ToB isn't a problem unless combined with multiple resistances and the like. Especially since you've added dex penalties for heavy armor and cut down on stacking items of protection.

 

So what I'd like to see are ToB upgrades to +4 or +5 armors/shields for the Bioware NPCs, usually by combination with existing armors/shields à la IU, but generally only have a combination of the original items powers, or, at best, a minimal upgrade. Forex my idea for Improved Firecam would be AC -4, saves +2, the other specials from Firecam and the specials from the Armor of the Hart. This should cost something like 40,000 gold and a few expensive gems (I like that in IA, since otherwise they're almost always converted to gold ASAP).

 

Although an intermediate upgrade in chapter 6, perhaps combining it with the Pride of the Legion, would be useful if it dropped the armor class down to -1/2. AC 0 is a real disincentive to use Firecam late in SoA.

[Demivrgvs]

The discussion is going a little off topic but it's your thread.

 

I'm not so sure about IU's Firecam vs. your revised Armor of the Hart since I value the better AC by quite a bit. (I get really tired of Keldorn getting hit while trying to cast his True Sight or dispel something.) I think that a good AC in ToB isn't a problem unless combined with multiple resistances and the like. Especially since you've added dex penalties for heavy armor and cut down on stacking items of protection.

Am I right supposing you've not seen IR's Firecam Armor? Cause you're still talking of it as an armor with AC 0, +1 to saves and Free Action, instead of IR's AC -1, with Magic Damage Resistance and Retribution ability.

 

With IR characters can reach really high AC values by the time you reach the end of SoA:

- dexterity penalties won't affect this too much, characters only have to wear armors appropriate for their dexterity level. Keldorn won't be affected at all by heavy armors' dexterity penalties because his dexterity wouldn't give him any bonus anyway;

- IR allows to use one item of protection together with magical armor, which is more than vanilla allowed, but wearing "multiple items of protections" would be really unbalancing;

- IR's revised shields and the respective component allow shield bearers to became extremely effective tanks.

 

Regarding the upgrade you've suggested, I fear it's a little over the top:

- Full plate +5 (+6 enhancement bonus)

- +2 to saves (+2 enhancement bonus)

- Free Action (+2 enhancement bonus)

- Heroic Inspiration (+1 enhancement bonus)

The total enhancement bonuses reach artifact levels, which in IR only a handful items are allowed to reach (SotM, Carsomyr, Crom Faeyr, Ring of Gaxx). I'm not here to despise IA but don't look at IA's upgradeable items as a good example of power level, most of them are way more powerful than the most enchanted IR's items, and I consider IR Cespenar's upgrades already incredibly outstanding.

Last but not least, with IR installed I'm not sure you'll be able to have 40000 gold to spare too often (at least one of my goals is to avoid that), as prices have been slightly raised and reputation's discount has been removed.