Applying effect and dispelling it in the same spell - is it possible?

[SparrowJacek]

Hello,

I would like to introduce to my mod a spell, which deals fire damage and is able to hurt even creatures with 100% fire resistance. For that I want to use opcode #30 fire resistance modifier. But the tricky part is, that I don't want this effect to last after the spell is done even for a second, as it would enable player to time his spells well and for example hit with 10 fireballs right after the initial spell. So is there a way to

1. Ensure, that I lower fire resistance BEFORE damage part of the spell hits and

2. Ensure that the effect which lowers fire resistance is dispelled right AFTER damage part of the spell hits?

I tried to achieve the 1st part via using opcode #177 "Use eff file", but even though th effect reducing fire resistance is set before the one, which deals damage, enemies with 100% fire resistance still lost 0 hitpoints. So is such effect even possible?

 

Thank you for your time!

SparrowJacek

[Ardanis]

Set 30's timing mode to duration, 0 seconds, followed by fire damage. That's been proven to work. If you need conditional targeting for that, use 326 to make sure both effects remain in one package - not sure that's why 177 doesn't work for you, but 50/50 that nesting adds one tick delay.

As for dispelling solution, with 321 at the end your spell should be able to clear itself from target.

[SparrowJacek]

Well that's strange... I might be doing something wrong, but when I use "Increment" with negative value to reduce magic resistance, then it doesn't work... but if I change ONLY "Increment" to any of the other 2 values ("Set" or "% modifier"), then it works properly, even with Duration=0

 

All tests are done on Larloch's Minor Drain which bypasses magic resistance.

From this screen:

1. The opcode which is seen at the bottom of the screen

2. Cast magic missile (which also don't deal dmg)

3. Deal magical damage (delay 1)

[Ardanis]

Type=1 (set) definitely should work. Can't remember if I saw a case of type=0 working, but I wouldn't be surprised if it's yet another engine quirk.

[kjeron]

Increment values don't update until after the effect stack has cleared, likely until the following tick.

Set Value/% update immediately, but ignore any pre-existing increment bonuses until the following tick.

The 6 Saving Throw modifier opcodes have an additional mode, "Increment Instantly", which do just that, but it's a semi-recent addition and AFAIK no other opcode has such.

For damage resistance, you are better off setting the value to 0, as any negative increment could result in negative resistance.

Edited May 17, 2022 by kjeron

[SparrowJacek]

I have another question regarding some similar issues.

 

Let's say I want to improve "Cause critical wounds" spell for my kit. I want it to deal more damage and #332 (0x14C) Stat: Specific Damage Modifier  looks like a thing I need. I would like to increase my damage right before the effect from item ability "opcode 12: Deal damage" lands, so the damage is increased, but then it's dispelled immediately. Is it possible? Or does this opcode suffer from similar problems? 

 

I tried to achieve my goal using:  #248 (0xF8) Item: Set Melee Effect  as in IESDP I read:

Note: This opcode applies its effect inbetween base weapon damage and the on-hit effects of the weapon.

Unfortunately I am not able to make it right... Do you guys have any suggestions?

[Ardanis]

If you're modding the Cause Wounds directly, I think you may as well try to just delay the 12 by 1s. Don't think anybody would really notice or care...

You can also leave the original .itm intact and make the corresponding .spl overwrite the created weapon for your kit with modded version. Don't think 326 accepts kit.ids, but you can either mark your kit with splstate, or use 146/206 combo:
1) 146 spl_A and 146 spl_B
2) spl_A applies 206 against spl_B
3) spl_B applies actual desired effect(s)
4) apply 206 against spl_A to any specific target (e.g. via kit's passives) you want to be affected by spl_B

Edited May 20, 2022 by Ardanis