Demivrgvs

Not likely. Once it's ready, it will just be officially released. Demi can provide access to the current version if you want to beta test.

Hi everyone, I'm also interested in having this version for beta test. I'm a huge fan of this mod, SR and also looking forward to using KR. Besides I'd appreciate giving my help if any detail occurs. So should I ask directly to Demivrgvs?

I sent you a PM.

I know I'm "late to the party", but I'd love to be able to give the beta a whirl. I'm about to start a trilogy EE run and would really like to use SR with it. Being able to help out and test at the same time would just be a bonus - so hopefully I'm not too late!

I'm late to answer instead. Check your PMs.

I'll edit StF green scroll to correctly work, and it can be made so that it cures both the new SR petrification (via sec type) and any eventual vanilla-like effect (old cure petrification opcode).

 

For Haste and Slow there's no issue afaik. Non-SR variants of these two effects not using the custom sec type still counter each other via opcode as per vanilla (aka, not fully counter), while the IR/SR variants can finally fully counter each other.

@Hoverdawg, thanks for the bug reports and feedback.

NPC's Custom Equipment

Nerf some of the NPCs' items. It's weird to use the same stuff they started with for almost the whole game.

You have a point, but I think NPC's personal items should be used to make each NPC more unique rather than considering them normal equipment. Without those items any PC generated character can be the same improved copy of existing NPCs (except Viconia maybe) while these items help keeping NPCs somewhat special, am I wrong?

 

My idea was to make NPC items really good and as unique as possible within their specific item-type. Good enough to remain appealing for most of the game, but not enough to outshine top tier items.

 

Mage Robes

Mmm, you are not the first one to say that the Robe of the Weave is the least appealing one but I still don't understand why. Does SCS use Lower Magic Resistance so much? Because that robe combined with the SotM gives a whopping 40% magic resistance which sounds cool on paper. Am I missing something?

 

STAT-enhancing items

I'm not a fan of items giving +attributes rather than setting their values, especially the Strength ones. They weren't really used for low-strength characters anyway (well, maybe Viconia) and, without stacking, their power wasn't *that* enormous, but significant. Now, a 19 STR character can reach 24 STR easily, and it's very easy to jump over the 18/x hill.

There's only one potential issue introduced by this change, and that's the "stat stacking", but it's almost not-existent within IR imo because I purposely almost never use +X STR bonuses on items

 

Previously any low STR character could reach STR 19+ too easily imo (e.g. Jaheira would benefit from those belts as much as Viconia, if not more imo) making their starting STR value completely irrelevant. The latter is what I liked the least, and it's even worse imo for stuff like the Ring of Influence which could turn an idiot with no charm into the most cool charismatic influential person in town.

 

You seem to imply that the change made it easier to reach higher STR values, but I fail to see it. If you give these belts to STR optimized character you get similar results to vanilla belts. For example Girdle of Fire Giant Strength was granting STR 22, now it gives +3, thus only a character with STR 19 (half-orc? charname with STR manual?) can reach the same STR value of vanilla belt. The only case where I would have said you were spot on was the old IR's Girdle of Hill Giant Strength, because that +2 STR was kinda cheap and could make 18+ values too easy to achieve...but that's not the case anymore.

 

Arrow of Dispelling

The problem of this particular arrow imo is that it can easily go from OP to too weak. If I made the arrow too weak we may increase the save penalty, or make these arrows more easy to get (e.g. more places, lower price), but vanilla "no save - 100% chance" was really too much of an "I win button" against mages imo. What do you guys think?

 

Potions

@Jarno, maybe Kreso was thinking about a fixed caster lvl? A variable one make less sense imo, why would the potion's power be tied to the imbiber level? Anyway, using caster level is really hard to balance in both cases, and would make potions unreliable again. If a particular potion is too good and I would probably shorten its duration, or nerf its effects a little bit rather than making it affected by dispel again, especially considering SCS mages almost always out level the party and thus would almost always dispel potions again, no?

Multiple Save vs messages

So, should I put "Saving Throw Fix=0" as the default setting for SR's ToBEx? Btw, why no one before Shaitan ever reported the issue in all this time?

 

Monster Summoning

The following around part is intended. It can be a hassle but i think it's mostly a boon.

You can disable and re-enable it in-game pointing the creature and pressing CTRL+F. All SR summons have this check, and you can also fully disable their AI if you wish with CTRL+D.

 

On a side note, if you want to go stealth you can also simply not conjure an army of summons!

 

I think Demivrgvs didn't come around to implement it yet. Like the checks for Fiend summoning, Mind Blank and a few other planned spells.

Yeah, but I've not given up on those things. Almost everything planned will sooner or later be part of SR.

 

Dispelling Screen

seems to have a longer duration than the stated 1 turn.

Which version are you using? It was casting time 1 with 10 rounds duration but on the last build it should be cs 5 and 5 turns duration.

A dump of the red coloring mentioned earlier. The contigency has a reddish glow to it.

I have no idea what's going on, but SR doesn't touch those bams at all. Are you on EE or vanilla?

 

Greater Spell Deflection

says "spells greater than level 4 will not be affected". I hope this is a typo.

Yes, it is. I was sure I fixed that typo a few builds ago but it's strangely there indeed. Thanks for reporting.

The colour of the scroll: Prot. from electricity is more red than normal. Is that a remnant of some kind (ie same colour when you are not able to use that scroll)?

?!? I have 3 different ProElectricity scrolls, two of them have blue icons (priest and mage variant) and one has a green icon (usable by all variant). I have no reddish icon in my game. What do you mean with "more red than normal"? o.O

 

What about curative scrolls, shouldn't they be cleric only?

They are usable by divine casters, but I assume you are suggesting to make them not usable by druids/rangers, are you?

@beta testers, I have a free afternoon today, thus if you have reports or suggestions to make this is the right time to tell me where to work.

 

- Belt of Inertial Barrier is bugged. (can't remeber what exactly, I think target is wrongly set to self, probably the duration is also wrong). Fixed locally and changed to no-save, 2 rounds -20%MS, can't be affected more than 1x turn. The feedback window simply gets too spammed with save vs x message.

 

- Fireshield from Ring of Fire Control is breachable. (tweaked locally to cast a real Fireshield, not a mimickry).

- Mov rate opcode had incorrect targeting yes, but you do have a point about the "spamming"

 

- the ring's custom Fireshield is there because we don't want it to call Cowled Wizards, and because it has "special additions" to make it grant full immunity to fire dmg animation (ring grants 50%, spell grants 50% plus ProSpell 206s to grant full immunity to fire based effects).

 

- The first thing I noticed was the Readme needing some rearrangement.

 

- I know it has been a while since last time, but the potions part is adopted into the main component now?

- Mike is working on it

 

- yes

1.) Not sure if this is IR or SR but Shield no longer protects from magic missiles from Wand of Magic Missiles though the spell Magic Missile is still blocked correctly. This is both on BGT and BG:EE.

 

2.) Burning Hands doesn't work very well on BG:EE, the aoe backfires on red circle opponents so you can't actually hit them, even if you target the ground. When you target green circles the fire effect goes in the right direction and damage is dealt.

1) The issue is caused by IR which makes the wand cast an actual custom spl. It already works fine when IR is not installed, but with the next SR build the spell will take into account IR's new Magic Missile variant. Thanks for reporting it.

 

2) This is really odd, and the spell always worked fine on standard installs. What do you mean exactly with "the AoE backfires"? The flames turn against you? o.O Can anybody else reproduce the same issue?

Is this due to SR?

 

Regarding SPCL037.spl

I'm pretty sure SR neither has nor modifies that resource.

@Baptor, I've found an error (main spell uses spenblade.pro and should have no projectile at all) but afaik that should actually do nothing. I'll test it in my game asap and let you know.

 

@Salk, you're probably right. On a side note I do not like the 4th wall breaking "go to the history page of an unidentified item and press the Identify button" too.

For the official release ask Mike, for me any build from now on looks fine enough for an official release. I have quite a few big changes in store for specific items but as soon as compatibility stuff (should be fine right now) and readme (Mike is working on it) are ready I would personally release the mod.

 

Anyway, I'll give you access to the current build. You'll be the one asking me if you think the mod is ready or not.

 

@Salk, what's the problem there? The look isn't great but it's the expected one.

@hemike, don't worry criticism is always welcome when it's constructive.

 

Negative Energy Damage

Skull Trap and ADHW are not actually meant to cause energy damage, that was a Bioware decision...

Actually, the official AD&D spell description says: "When the skulltrap discharges, the skull flashes briefly with red or violet light and violently explodes, releasing a blast of energy drawn from the Negative Material Plane. The burst of negative energy inflicts 2d4 points of damage plus l d4 points of damage for every level of the caster."

I already said I agree that Horrid Wilting should instead be "untyped dmg" (ideally, Jarno's suggested Magic Cold would be perfect), but the AI simply cannot handle the change (for both offensive and defensive scripts).

 

@Jarno, didn't ToBEx and/or EE fixed Magic Cold dmg type to not cause crashes?

Negative Energy is the lack of energy; a drain, an enervating force. Necromancy spells should harm in that fashion: level draining, health draining, aging, wilting (PnP wilting), etc.

I mostly agree, but I don't see why it cannot also do some sort of necrotic damage. I never liked 4th edition, but 5th edition looks kinda good, and necrotic dmg is there too.

 

Invocation spells should do damage via positive energy, a.k.a. "magic energy." And, Conjuration and Transmutation spells should do damage via elemental effects.

Wait...you think Evocations should not use elemental dmg? o.O

"Protection from Energy" should be renamed "Protection from Negative Energy" and should not protect against Magic Missile.

As Jarno says, that would really be a problem. What dmg type should I then use for stuff like Holy weapons, Holy Smite, Sunray, Magic Missile, Disintegration, etc?

 

Overall, I just pretend magic dmg is a more generic dmg type, which includes stuff like holy dmg, necrotic dmg, light-based dmg and force dmg.

I'll try to catch up with all the stuff discussed here in the last week...

 

Removed/replaced spells & new spells

@hemike, despite V4 taking a more daring approach on this matter, it's still hugely less drastic than you seem to believe. If I'm not wrong you are actually judging the mod before trying it out, give it a chance and then let me know. I doubt you will feel the loss of any spell, and I'm almost sure that, despite the massive amount of changes they bring, both IR and SR are among the best mods when it comes to blend with vanilla game without giving that strange "mod-added" feeling.

 

I'm always extremely reluctant when it comes to "remove" a spell, and when I do it's because I have really good reasons (e.g. the original spell is utterly useless, overlap with another spell, can be replaced by a much better one, etc.). Note that whenever I "remove" a spell, that spell is actually replaced by another one, which has to pass a lot of checks before being approved (e.g. must be PnP based, fit the removed spell role almost flawlessly, belong to a magic school that really need a new spell, etc.).

 

For new spells it's the same thing: very few make it, and if they do it's because they blend into the game really well, they fill a much needed role (e.g. improving underrepresented schools) or add something unique (e.g. Ball Lightning, Striking Wave, etc.).

 

Making new spells optional is slightly easier than making multiple install options for the main component, but the whole system is heavily interconnected now, and removing even a few spells might led to some flaws.

 

Banishment

@janoha, the problem Death Spell's "slay 8HD creatures with no save" had is that such an effect is either really OP (e.g. high level BG1 mage vs. party members) or completely useless (within BG2). BG makes that even more unreliable because creatures HD stat quite often do not reflect their expected power lvl, not counting how many times that stat simply have a wrong value.

 

Going back to the above discussion, Banishment replaced Death Spell because the latter never had anti-summon properties in PnP, and concept wise it made no sense for it to have them, while such effect is indeed what Banishment does in PnP, and what the AI uses this spell for.

 

Horrid Wilting

@subtledoctor, I do not like that this spell uses magic dmg but that has to stay (AI checks for it), as well as the current name I fear. It's one of the most famous BG spells and you can see on this very topic that some players really dislike spell renaming. Btw, there's really no PnP spell that could take its place, the only really daring option imo could be to "merge" HW into Symbol of Death.

 

On a side note, Necromancy spells dealing magic dmg do makes sense as it represents Negative Energy dmg (e.g. Cause Wound spells, Skull Trap, Unholy Blight, etc.), what the most recent D&D editions call Necrotic dmg.

 

@n-ghost, yes SR's Horrid Wilting do not affect elementals, undead and illusionary creatures. I think it worked like that since V3, but it surely does now.

There is the wrong ground icon for one of the game's shields.

 

You need to add this:

WRITE_ASCII 0x44 ~GSHLD05~ #8

Main component? It looks fine on my install.

 

@Mad Mate, good catches indeed, cool to have a debugger like you around.

I am not sure if this is a SR bug or just a BG2 bug but....

 

Whenever you create a Simulacrum or Project Image of yourself, they banter incessantly about their spells failing, pick pocketing, and setting a trap. It doesn't affect gameplay but it is slightly annoying.

Never heard of this bug before...is anyone else experiencing it? o.O

 

Any chance to opt into the beta? I'm planning an EE trilogy playthrough in the upcoming weeks and SR is always a welcome addition.

Sure, no problem. Afaik the current build is almost entirely bug free, though I need Arda to reappear for a couple of things.

I do hope his 5001st post will be "new IR beta is out; come and get it.".

And here it is my 5001st post, albeit it doesn't make me as proud as I imagined it.

 

I've uploaded a new build, but it sadly misses 50% of the new cool stuff because I simply never manage to sit down in peace and mod without pressure (e.g. I was "free" this weekend but then I ended up having only 1-2 hours to mod because of damn RL stuff).

 

Short story: I decided to at least upload what was ready for packaging and then do smaller updates later. At least it contains the fixes for all the reported bugs and issues (mostly "minor fixes").

 

V4 - Beta 5 (26 October 2014)

 

 

 

P.S I think I sent PMs to all new beta testers but if I missed any of you just remind it to me please, I'm terribly messed up lately.

 

Ok. I'm almost* done with SCS compatibility add-on. If anybody wants to help with playtesting, let me know.

One thing I haven't done yet is Beholders. Frankly, if I remain true to checks I added to all other scripts, I fear that Imp.Beholders may become an overkill . Then again, they're worth 9k EXP at least.... any ideas? Even if I don't add IR specific checks, they already are sensibly hard. I'm undecided.

I'll be honest, I've always dreaded the parts of BG2 where there are beholders or mind flayers. They are stupid powerful and require constant reloads. Just about every other fight in the game is a joke without something like SCS but beholders and mind flayers need no assistance.

 

@Kreso, care to explain? Except for Elder Orbs how are Beholders affected by SR?

 

@Baptor, while IR nerfed the Shield of Cheese it's still hugely effective against them, and I'm quite sure you have a lot of "convenient but hugely expensive" stuff to counter beholders or mind flayers, such as the Greenstone Amulet or Psion's Blade. To a certain extent IR's not dispellable potions are also a huge boost when facing beholders imo.

I didn't realize about gust of wind actually. That can work. Also, can you point me to which snare ability you referring to? I don't see it in the kit descriptions.

Yeah sorry, there's little mention of all the work that has been done to Paladin and Ranger spellbooks, I need to do something about it. Snare is a ranger-only new spell, take SR's Fire Trap and replace fire dmg with an entangle effect. It's a 2nd lvl spell, thus you get it at lvl 8.

 

I was thinking about how it's common for archers IRL to poison their arrows or light them on fire. A sufficiently advanced archer should be able to do that to a small degree without having to rely on "magical" arrows.

I was indeed thinking to give Archer something like Flaming Arrow instead of True Ranger's Blades of Fire. That being said, BG is full of magical arrows of all types, and too much stuff like that could turn the kit into an Arcane Archer.

 

I have to do some research when it comes to Rangers and Poison within FR lore. AD&D rangers in particular were sort of paladins of nature, and while I can see them using poison against monsters I don't know if their morals would let them poison humans. A true poison ability would also heavily overlap with the Assassin. Arrows with entangle, sleep, or similar effects would make much more sense imo, but I cannot promise anything about it.

 

What about offsetting the bonus to hit and damage with missile weapons? Right now, you get bonuses at 0, 4, 8, 12, 16. Would it make a difference if we do 4, 7, 10, 13, 16 (meaning archer doesn't start with that bonus)?

Without a +1 bonus at 1st level the Archer would be inferior to a True Fighter even within its specialization because it would have no advantage and tons of disadvantages (terrible melee skills, light armor, less hit points, etc.).

I can also think of a good many BG2 fights that cram you into tiny spaces. If we can make up some excuse to give the archer a spell / ability that shoves an enemy away, would that help balance the positional issues you mentioned? Being a ranger, even an ankle snare type ability would be fitting.

With SR they get, Gust of Wind, KR gives them Snare. With KR making it immune to Entangle even that vanilla spell is especially good for him imo.

 

Called Shots can be used for similar purposes too, and we can easily slightly edit them.

 

The other approach could be to make the archer's glass-cannon-ness even greater, allowing it to be the undisputed champion of bows at high levels (meaning there is no way a fighter should be able to match up with a bow). Increased critical hit rate, adding alternate damage types, bleeding side effects, etc. are all options to consider, IMO.

I was considering them indeed, except alternate dmg types, unless you mean allowing them to infuse arrows with some divine spell. Even then I do not see PnP spells doing that, thus it would be limited to HLAs I think.

 

Regarding the Archer being almost OP for BG1 I agree with Kreso that the game itself favor ranged combat too much at low levels (IR already tried to rectify this a bit by reducing bow's apr), but the original BG1 had no Archer kit, which arguably makes that even more noticeable with its thac0/dmg bonuses. I'll think about it a bit more, but I don't know what can be done about it.

 

Otoh I'm really not worried about the late game potential instead. I remember an old run of mine where charname Archer dominated the battlefield (and party's kill %) even for late SoA/ToB, and the current Archer is even more versatile imo with better spells and improved Called Shots. Obviously this is a good example of a class that work extremely better when part of a party, where he can rain death from afar while a tank cover him.

Thanks for the feedback.

 

I'm not balancing anything around solo gameplay, and never will. For what I care this game xp mechanic and its encounters should be tweaked to make solo games impossible or at least terribly punitive. With the current system a small party makes the game easier and with certain classes even soloing quickly became unbalanced because of the ridiculous power lvl the single character achieve.

 

Leaving that aside, I do imagine that playing a BG1 solo Monk with 14 DEX is bad, much like playing a KR Berserker with 14 CON, but that is not "roleplaying" imo. Considering the background of a Monk character all his stats should be kinda good imo, and if you add to this that we are speaking of a Bhaalspawn I would expect somthing like 17/18/16 or not much less. DEX, especially for BG1 is the most important stat for a Monk.

 

I'm instead pleased to hear that in a "normal game" the class works fine. Your only complain seem to be the lack of "toys to play with" at low levels, but other players actually seemed to consider them too many. Overall I'd say 5 different abilities (Stunning Fist, Ki Step, Ki Dodge, Ki Arrow, Wholeness of Body) for a melee warrior is enough for BG1.

Banishment

From description: "The gated genie is immune to Death Spell". I have to update the description though.

 

No idea why it's not working on the Aerial Servant though, and while destself has no target it never did afaik and always worked. o.O Will check.

newest version of IR going to include some new ideas for items, or is it bugfixes?

Knowing how Demi functions, it will probably include 100+ newly revised items as well

You do know me! Jokes aside, it's not going to be 100+ re-revised items but the amount of items that are getting more than simple fixes is still quite long. Most of them are only refinements of the already existing concept (e.g. Blackblood's Acid Splash getting a small AoE or Blackrazor's Souldrinking enhancement now triggering when a target dies), but there are few cases where I dared to do a bit more.

Hey,

any chance you could be sharing the beta with me?

Sure, will send a PM.

 

Edit: I have to wait for an admin to give you authorisation.

Prismatic Mantle

What we need to accomplish is making its prismatic effects powerful enough that players would think twice (or more) before attacking an AI caster using it, but at the same time not too powerful to avoid AI mass suicide when attacking it.

So in short we must make sure that the AI get the best treatment from both ends...

It doesn't get any advantage over players, I only want to make sure the AI doesn't get disadvantaged when using or facing it. Both Mantle spells had no real use, because PfMW was cheaper and better, and you guys are still getting a shiny new tool to use.