Revision of the Dispel Magic mechanic

[polytope]

On 6/6/2022 at 10:07 PM, suy said:

Hi @polytope. While I understand that this mod is not that important in BG1, I wanted to try it regardless there, and when I was going to install it, I got a message saying that ToB is required. The check seems to be:

BEGIN @10 DESIGNATED 10

REQUIRE_PREDICATE FILE_EXISTS_IN_GAME ~mel01.cre~ @13

So, how comes that such thing is needed? Isn't BG1EE technically enough? Thank you.

I designed under the assumption that players would be using either vanilla BG2-ToB, BG2EE, or one of the trilogies. From memory, the reasons I required ToB were:

• Subtle opcode differences (possibly harmless and unimportant) between the BG2 and BG2-ToB engine, and the needed opcode 220 doesn't exist in BG1 or IWD1 vanilla engine anyway
• The component for PnP Carsomyr and Arrows of Dispelling disables the ToB upgrade for Carsomyr, and the option to make Project Image a HLA assumes existence of HLAs, so those components (@20 & @23) in the setup would need the REQUIRE_PREDICATE added there instead.
• Importantly, this mod patches a bunch of innate HLAs that had a wizard school so these can't be dispelled, I really should have used ALLOW_MISSING instead, but here are the ones that need to be commented out for it presumably not to choke on a BG1EE game (I don't know whether the high level wizard spells exist as referenced files in BG1EE either).

//Some abilities need their school changed

COPY_EXISTING ~spcl907.spl~ ~override~
	      ~spcl913.spl~ ~override~
	      ~spcl914.spl~ ~override~
	      ~spcl915.spl~ ~override~
	      ~spcl916.spl~ ~override~
	      ~spcl917.spl~ ~override~
	      ~spcl918.spl~ ~override~
	      ~spcl919.spl~ ~override~
	      ~spcl928.spl~ ~override~
	      ~spcl929.spl~ ~override~
	      ~spcl930.spl~ ~override~
WRITE_BYTE 0x25 0

[suy]

Great. I'll keep this in mind if I ever give a shot to modifying the code to work in BG1EE. Thank you for the mod and the reply!

[feedwony]

hello. should this be installed before or after SCS? 

does it work on BG1EE? and if not, will the dispel magic discrepancy be noticeable between BG1 and 2? especially together with "Reduce power of Inquisitors' Dispel Magic" SCS component? thank you

[polytope]

6 hours ago, feedwony said:

hello. should this be installed before or after SCS?

For now you may want to install it before SCS simply because SCS (current version!) clones remove magic to SPIN138 called INNATE_FIEND_DISPEL_MAGIC, the version used by fiends. If you installed polydisp after current SCS, then fiends (but not other spellcasters) would use remove magic with vanilla behaviour.

Then again, SCS is slow to install and polydisp is very fast, so ideally polydisp would come after SCS, I'll fix the fiend loophole in the next version.

On the other hand, if you installed aTweaks fiends instead of SCS, polydisp should be installed after that, I accounted for aTweaks' fiend version of RM, but was unaware SCS did the same.

Also, if you want to play with the Spell Revisions mod, definitely install polydisp after SR.

6 hours ago, feedwony said:

 especially together with "Reduce power of Inquisitors' Dispel Magic" SCS component?

This mod revises the inquisitor kit's dispel magic to operate at 4 levels above their actual level, so don't install the SCS nerf together with it (as seen on the first page although I've misquoted the probabilities, I'll fix that).

6 hours ago, feedwony said:

does it work on BG1EE? and if not, will the dispel magic discrepancy be noticeable between BG1 and 2?

For now it doesn't work on BG1 unless you're using Baldur's Gate Trilogy, because it searches for a filename present only in ToB, I did this to prevent it being installed on original BG1 (where it wouldn't work) or original BG2 without the ToB modifications to the game engine. Future versions should include BG1EE compatibility.

I honestly wouldn't memorize Dispel or Remove Magic in BG1, you have too few lvl 3 slots to make it worth taking a chance on, and you don't encounter enemies with Protection From  X Weapon type spells even with SCS. I'll be honest that I haven't played Siege of Dragonspear and am unsure of the importance of dispelling there. The exception is for the Inquisitor I guess who gets it for free whereas other paladins at these levels can't cast any spell... I really don't think BG2 kits are properly balanced for BG1 even after all these years, but that's another story.

Edited February 26, 2023 by polytope

[feedwony]

12 hours ago, polytope said:

For now you may want to install it before SCS simply because SCS (current version!) clones remove magic to SPIN138 called INNATE_FIEND_DISPEL_MAGIC, the version used by fiends. If you installed polydisp after current SCS, then fiends (but not other spellcasters) would use remove magic with vanilla behaviour.

On the other hand, if you installed aTweaks fiends instead of SCS, polydisp should be installed after that, I accounted for aTweaks' fiend version of RM, but was unaware SCS did the same.

good to know! I can't think of anything else that should cause conflict but I could post my current WIP mod order if you don't mind looking it over. (I have used only UI mods in the past)

11 hours ago, polytope said:

I haven't played Siege of Dragonspear

it would be nice to have this mod at certain points of SoD (such as endgame or the optional battle in castle basement), so I"ll keep an eye in case there's a new version before I do my install.