subtledoctor

BG2Tweaks (aka "the G3 Tweak Pack") should really be installed before SCS. The only reason DavidW suggested installing it later is if you want to uninstall and reinstall the tweaks; doing so will cause SCS to uninstall and reinstall itself, which is very time-consuming. But that logic applies to any mod, not just the Tweak Pack.

For best results, you really should

1) really figure out what mods you want to install

2) install most of them before SCS (with some very few exceptions, like aTweaks, Widescreen, W_GUI, Level1NPCs)

3) don't mess with any mods that were installed before SCS.

Finally in the home stretch! Testing everything and getting some good results.

- backstab immunity: working! (now to add it to the Barbarian Ranger)

- Spellbender's improvisational casting: working!

- excluding Necromancy spells from bards: working!

- dual-class cheese reduction: working!

- Bladesinger: working!

- Shadow Step ported to the original engine: working!

- cleric favored weapons: working!

- new druid shapechanges: almost working. I need to figure out how to give an innate ability while shapechanged. Maybe add it to the .CRE file?

I still have a bunch of little adjustments to make, but it's only a few hours' work. Should be done soon.

Whoa - I don't even remember coding those AC bonuses. Okay, I reduced them to match the thac0 bonuses: +1 at 1st level, up to +4 at 15th level. Much more reasonable. I'll give them thief usabilities as well.

Oh, and I think I figured out what was wiping out the quickspells - should be fixed now. Yay! And I removed the references to opcode 321 from Swashbuckling, so Corsairs and Swashbucklers shouldn't crash the old engine either.

And I'm adding the kitted clerics' Favored Weapons to the Divine Class Tweaks, so you don't have to use the proficiency overhaul to let your priest of Selune wield a scimitar.

Getting there! My to-do list is down to eight items - one bit of coding (give spellcasting to Harriers, at a reduced rate) and seven "test ____" items. If the testing doesn't turn up to many major problems, v3 could go out in a matter of days!

*whew.* Then I'm taking a couple months off.

There are (at least one) other innates that will crash BG. "Swashbuckling" uses opcode 319 or such, which doesn't exist there.

Poop, good catch. I'm in final testing stages of v3, I'll fix that right now.

I think the spells thing can't be helped. The wizard stuff is so hard-coded, I think that as soon as the engine sees "oh here's a mage, and hey he has a kit! without any further investigation into what kit it is, I'm going to give him an extra spell.

Here's an interesting twist though: I rolled a multiclass mage/thief, used the Spellfilcher tome to give him a kit, and he got the extra spell/day of a specialist. I then rolled a thief, leveled up a bit, then dual-classed to mage, then became a Spellilcher... and now, gaining mage levels only, I am NOT getting extra spells. Maybe the 'OriginalClass' flag being set for a dual-class stops the engine from giving the bonus spells. ?? Who knows?

If it's any consolation, with my v3 wizard kit tweaks specialists will no longer get extra spells. I mean they will, because it's hard-coded, but all mages will get them and there are no opposition schools. So in that context, the Bladesinger will have a normal amount of spells (i.e. the same as a normal mage).

Is this really more powerful than PnP? I suppose the Bladesong ability itself is more powerful, since it's based on BG2 Blade's Offensive Spin. But the PnP Bladesinger gets a passive -1 bonus to melee AC *permanently* i.e. up to -10 AC at all times (depending on level limits). That's insane. My Bladesong ability gives a max -4 AC (I think), and only while the Song is active.

Btw I didn't specifically decide to make Bladesong prevent Haste, it was leftover from Offensive Spin. But I kind of like it being there, if only because increasing movement speed to 4x would be kind of silly. What I should do, is remove the Haste protection, and have Bladesong *set* movement speed to some value instead of just doubling it. Or find some other way for them to work together without things getting crazy.

But profsmax.2da is respected in the EEs, and I think with TobEx.

I highly doubt that it's something to do with the kit itself. It's a bog-standard mod kit, a simple fighter kit with the 0x00004000 trueclass usability flag and some extra AP_ and GA_ stuff in its CLAB file.

Kits will use the weapprof.2da columns, but I think the issue is that fighter/mage has its own column in that file - as if it were a kit. So if you apply a kit to a fighter/mage (something that is not anticipated by the engine) the question is, will the game use the kit column for fighter/mage, or the column for the added kit?

If it's the former, then giving Bladesingers higher max weapon mastery than normal fighter/mages will be impossible unless my new proficiency overhaul is used. In that case I can just make the kit's installation contingent on the overhaul being installed. Or just restrict the kit to the same max as fighter/mages.

If that was the case, using this ability is sure CTD. Maybe IWDEE engine (or other EEs) support it, but vanilla game surely doesn't.

That would explain why I haven't seen any crashes in my IWDEE test game. But, an easy fix - my favorite kind! Though, it still doesn't explain why the ability wipes out your quickslot spells...

Also, the Bladesinger kit cannot progress past specialization in any weapons, in spite of what the readme says. Kitlist.2da looks fine and weaponprof.2da has up to 5 pips in several weapons for Bladesinger, however upon testing it seems it's using the standard fighter/mage's column (tweaking the standard ftr/mage column allowed me to advance past specialization). If it matters, the name on top of the character record as well as the kit description from the same page also show 'Fighter/Mage', not Bladesinger. The only place where 'Bladesinger' shows is the right side 'parchment' area by the experience points.

Hmm. I thought profsmax.2da would determine the class's max (fighter/mages) and your kit would be determined by the column in weaprof.2da. This report means that even if you have a kit with its own column, the game still forces you to use the fighter/mage column. There may be no way to get around this. Actually, there will be, if you use v3's proficiency overhaul - with that, Bladesingers should be able to reach grandmastery while normal fighter/mages can only reach mastery. I'll do some testing to confirm.

I don't think Aerie's component requires the multiclass tweaks. I have heard that some people on BWS are getting errors with the NPC components. That happens when there are more than 255 kits installed - congratulations, you must have a rather aggressive BWS install.

If you can wait a week or two, v3.0 will address this issue, allowing the kitted NPC components to install with as many as 1280 kits installed.

Yeah I figured it might be based on Offensive Spin, so I replaced the default D5_Blad1.spl with a copy of Offensive Spin with added ac bonus (btw, when I set the ac bonus to be vs melee, i.e. checked the boxes for slashing, crushing, piercing, it crashed. when I unchecked them, i.e. applicable vs all attacks, crashing stopped) and thac0 bonus scaled to be +1 every 5 lvls, and it seems to work fine now.

That spell is all sorts of problematic. It also wipes out my quickslot spells whenever I cast it. Why? Who knows.

Also I think I started with Ofennsive Spin from an EE game, so there's probably some cruft in the file that causes problems in the old engine. I'll probably just build a whole new ability from the ground up instead of using Offensive Spin.

I think that's okay. What would the point of the ability be if the AI was programmed such that you could never see the benefit of it?

Yes, I know, the barbarian would personally benefit because he wouldn't get attacked... but that means you shift the backstabs away from the high-hp guy to the squishier guys. Meaning, "Immunity to Backstab" will literally change from being a benefit to a tactical weakness. A pretty drastic change to the underlying intent of the game.

I certainly don't think that (detecting the immunity and backstabbing someone else) should be default behavior.

What, really?? Is that the Bladesinging ability? I just played a whole game of IWDEE on my iPad, never had a problem. That ability is based Blades' Offensive Spin, it's not even a fully home brewed thing.

Sigh. I'll look into it.

Actually I checked, and the Bladesinger is coded for Trueclass usability. So it's not a specialist thing. I'm switching it from s fighter kit to a wizard kit, I'll test how it works that way. It's possible that it's a hard-coded thing, that any kitted wizard automatically gets the specialist bonus.

Also, if you're using my altered spell tables, all wizards get slightly more lower-level spells than in vanilla. So you might be seeing that, and not a Bladesinger issue at all. Or it could be a combination of the two. I'll look into it.

I didn't even consider armor - never thought someone would put heavy armor on a fighter/mage. But I can restrict that. I'll check into what class restrictions to give them. Barbarian might be could, they max at splint, right? Or thief - studded leather plus Elven chain?

I noticed that in my recent IWDEE game with a Bladesinger and a Spellfilcher: They both gained an extra 1st level spell when jumping from 1st to 2nd level in their non-wizard class (which is not supposed to happen) and then another spell when leveling up as a wizard (which is).

It's as if the game is treating it like a specialist, with a delayed reaction. Is it restricting you from Necromancy spells? Maybe using the Illusionist usability flag on a fighter kit is causing it. In which case the way faster advancement you're seeing is probably just that extra one spell per level.

I'll remove it in v3, which should be released next week (probably).

Ah. Yeah see I hate that kind of thing. If you know, does SCS check immunities and apy a d riot based on what it finds? Or does it just have a list of creatures and apply scripts based in their vanilla stats?

If the former, then it shouldn't be a problem to change creatures up...

Doing that will utterly screw up their AI.

Really? I didn't know they had much in the way of AI. Pre-buff so they can't be interrupted, immediately cast 3x Cloudkill in a small space, don't follow PC out of the small space... eh, this is probably my least favorite encounter in the whole game when SCS is installed. One of those times where, rather than eliminating cheese, SCS pretty much requires it. Not fun.

Allowing a more direct approach might improve things...

Here's a question: if I'm going to tackle Magic Resistance, what about other kinds of (lower case) resistance to magic?

Specifically I'm thinking about Rakshasa. Lore has them being bloodthirsty, man-eating savages from Hindu myths. They are shapechangers and powerful magicians. No discussion of them in general mythology contains any reference to special defenses. 2E gives them immunity to all magic below 8th level, but I can't see where that came from. And in later editions (3E, D20, Pathfinder etc.) that immunity seems to have disappeared.

So, should I also remove Rakshasas' magic immunity and replace it with something else? (Automatic saves or something like that.)

The same question would apply to liches, but their immunity seems more reasonable, since they are supremely powerful magical beings. But the idea that Rakshasa have *stronger* magical immunity than liches seems kind of ridiculous.

Thoughts?

Interesting - I've tested all of the NPCs a hundred times on all four games and they always go in without a problem. Did you find the bug in a mega-mod install? Some other mod must have triggered it... anyway, it's good to know, and it looks like an easy fix (my favorite kind!) so I'll get this fixed in the upcoming v3.0.

With TobEx installed you can install up to 1280 kits. TobEx adds a scroll bar to the kit selection panel so you can select them easily.

I originally made these kits for the EE games, since various kitpacks like DR and S&S were not updated yet. The EEs are still constrained in this way, and EE players are generally newer and less sophisticated about stuff like this, so the warning is basically for them.

How about "Spellbender?" Or maybe Spellwarper?

I kinda don't hate Spellbender.

"The goddess Mystra rules the fabled Weave of Faerun, the ethereal conduit that allows mortals to shape magical energies into spells and effects. In order to avoid disasters like that which befell Anauroch, Mystra ensures that the use of those energies is strictly controlled: spellcasters must formulate the Weave into specific, known spells, and must memorize the patterns of those spells in order to successfully release them.

But, as with any rigid system, the are gaps and shortcuts that may be used to circumvent Mystra's rules. Sorcerers are born with the ability to focus the Weave directly, though only into a limited number of effects. Wild mages shape spells without discipline, achieving powerful results at the risk of disastrous side-effects.

Unlike those classes, Spellbenders make a science of mapping the ways to bypass Mystra's restrictions. Practicing as generalist clerics and studying arcane magery, they study ways to manipulate the intersection of those two areas of magic. They may sacrifice a memorized wizard spell to instead create one of numerous divine effects; and they may sacrifice a memorized cleric spell to create an arcane effect. Some energy is lost in the translation - the improvisational effects must be spells of lower level than the one sacrificed. (It is unknown what happens to the lost energy - some believe this practice has contributed to the recent rise of wild magic and sorcerers. Spellbenders must be wary, as they are apt to be persecuted by Mystra's Monitors.)

While Spellbenders are not as powerful one-to-one as a Sorcerer or Wild Mage or Monitor, the studious application of their knowledge gives them precise control over the Weave that is unmatched by any other spellcaster."

Well, that mod hasn't seen any action in 11 years, so I'm not too worried. And there's actually another Spellweaver kit, I believe, in the Wild Mage Addition mods, which *has* seen some interest and updating in the last year of two (over on the baldursgate.com forums - not by the nod author but by interested fans).

It's not the end of the world. And this is a multiclass kit so it won't appear as s double in the selection screens, even for someone like you who throws every crazy kit mod into his game.

The idea here is that this spellcaster has can violate Mystra's hard edicts about how nagic must be planned and memorized - it's the thematic opposite of my 'Monitor of Mystra' kit which is meant to police use of the Weave. This kit is similar to a Sorcerer that way, except where a Sorcerer has that ability without trying or even necessarily wanting to, this kit actually goes out and *learns* how to break the rules.

I was going to make it for elves and half-elves, make it something to do with their eladrin blood, call it a "Fey Wizard" or "Fey Caster" or something. But I don't quite like the sound of those.

It's not released yet, so feel free to throw out some ideas. (Anyone, seriously, I'm all ears.) Brainstorming and constructive criticism are more helpful than just plain criticism.

On tap for the big v3.0 release, I've just about completed my wizard kit tweaks described here:

http://gibberlings3.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=27228&p=235334

I'm also nearly done coding my new multiclass cleric/mage kit, the Spellweaver, who can directly manipulate the Weave using cleric spell slots to cast wizard spells, and wizard spell slots to cast cleric spells.

Then I'll code up my fighter/thief variant of the Wizard Slayer, and a new Pit Fighter fighter kit, and at least a couple of the MR options. (Dealing with all the user-accessible +MR items is a huge undertaking, those things are everywhere... stupid cheesy Bioware grumble grumble)

And that will be 3.0! Yay!

That's a beauty. FZ? I have bike envy! I sold mine off (a Suzuki, also naked, very similar) and bought a car, I can't ride now that I'm married and starting a family. Need to be a responsible adult and all

Then I don't understand why you're talking about liches. The 'hardcore MR' option will simply flip the switch to make every spell subject to MR. About 7 lines of Weidu. It will not affect spell level immunity one iota. Basically, it will just mimic old-school BG1 rules.

On wizard slayers: willpower? Sure, but *how does it work?* Let's say, even in a magical world like Faerun, I want to turn my skin green. If I was a chameleon I could do it through their biological process, changing the pigment of their skin. A psionicist could use willpower to activate a psionic ability. A wizard could cast a spell. A priest could say a prayer/spell. But absent some kind of mechanism like that, I could will it to happen as much as I want, but it won't happen. Likewise, I couldn't just will myself to have MR. So, with wizard slayers, what is the *mechanism* that allows his willpower to control a powerful and supernatural ability like Magic Resistance??

See, I think you give Bioware way, way too much credit when it comes to the quality of their "winging it." I am bothered by the illogical and unexplained way the ability is applied in the game, so I want to create a couple options for players who feel similarly.

If you think the vanila game's treatment of MR is just fine, then feel free not to use this mod

[edited for clarity in the 2nd paragraph since I don't understand Jarno's response]

Actually it's that friendly spells bypass the Magic Resistance if the target so wants. Now of course the later is not actually scripted, but just set so in the spell itself.

I'm sorry, are you using the word "actually" to explain a made-up fact about a made-up power possessed by made-up creatures, in a game of make-believe with a thousand inconsistent versions and a thousand internal inconsistencies within each version?

So how does it work, exactly? You can control your own magic resistance? If you can lower it for friendly spells, can you lower it halfway, or to any point between between zero and your max value? Or is it just on/off? What is the actual mechanism for lowering it? Is us psionics? A mystical/magical power? How does WS, a fighter kit with no particular aptitude for magic, develop this very magical-seeming ability with such great control over it?

And, where is your citation to any published lore on *any* of this, that leads you to use the word "actually?"

I rather think it's illogical cheesy BS coded by Bioware in an inconsistent and annoying way.

As for liches, no I won't be rewriting any scripts. MR is very powerful and if you want to play with the 'hardcore MR' option, that power comes with trade-offs. Even for liches. That is the only variant of the mod that would have this effect.

I personally would never play with that option, of course. It would be a little crazy and severely alter game balance. But, it would be logically consistent and it's technically possible, so as long as I'm coding up a mod, why not offer it as an option? More options are better.

Here's a preview of the work I'm doing on an overhaul of the game's Magic Resistance system.

I'm just starting to work on a mod that will address MR in a comprehensive way. I'm hoping to eventually have a few options.

 

1) Hardcore MR: it works as in the base game, but with no exceptions. So healing spells, Sunfire, Comet, etc. can all be blocked by MR. Possibly even potions as well.

 

2) Arcane-only MR: in BG1 MR could block healing spells, but Bioware removed this in BG2, without any stated justification. I'll offer a justification for that - the divine magic overcomes the resistance - and then take it to it's logical end, letting all priest spells bypass MR.

 

3) Logical MR: some aspects of MR don't make sense. A Fireball is created by magic but the fire itself is still very hot in a non-magical way, so it should still burn someone with MR, right? Under this option, direct magical effects like Charms and Holds and Magic Missiles will be blocked by MR, but non-magical environmental effects, that just happen to be created by a magic spell, will bypass it.

 

4) No MR: this most aggressive option will completely eliminate MR from the game. Every instance of MR in the game will be replaced with some combination of improved saves and/or elemental resistances, and/or immunity to spells up to x level (like rakshasas). MR-granting items, kits, and spells available to the player will be similarly changed.

I spent ten minutes working on option #4, and it's going to be a bigger and more complicated undertaking than I originally thought. 1-3 should be a lot easier, so maybe I'll start with them.

 

I take it there's no way to just add thief skill points to the Bard when they level up?

Well even if you set it up so, the Bard won't be able to use the thieving skills. It's hardcoded to the classes ...

This is way off-topic here, but: the cleric/thief has the "thievery" ability as an innate ability rather than on the main UI bar. Can you give this to a bard and apply skills in, say, Open Locks, via CLAB effects?

I know for a fact that you can do this with the Set Trap ability... my mod has a ranger kit that can use traps. I wonder if you can't do the same thing with lock-picking...

('Cause, if so, get ready for the bard kits in my mod to get more interesting! I think the Loremaster, in particular, should be able to pick locks.)