IR and Gladiators of Thay

[grodrigues]

In doing some high-level spell testing for SR, I fired up Gladiators of Thay and noticed that Anzol (or whatever the heck he is named) aggro's making the campaign unplayable. I have traced it to the main IR component; this does *not* happen if instead I use IRR. Has anyone traced this or even better, knows where exactly the problem lies?

[subtledoctor]

Never played it. Can you give more context? Who is he? Where is he encountered? Should I presume he us some kind of plot-centric neutral character?

Can you give his actual name so I can search for it in NI?

[grodrigues]

1 hour ago, subtledoctor said:

Never played it. Can you give more context? Who is he? Where is he encountered? Should I presume he us some kind of plot-centric neutral character?

It is Arzol (not Anzol), a bodyguard in the central arena. As soon as the meeting with the game master Dennaton is finished and you are teleported to the central square he aggros and goes after you. This should not happen and basically guarantees a game over.

Only IR's main component besides some UI mods, to be precise LeUI, EEUITweaks and Hidden gameplay options. On linux, in a case-insensitive partition.

More info needed, just holler.

Edited October 6, 2021 by grodrigues

[Bartimaeus]

Sorry to say that I literally don't know what Gladiators of Thay even is, and that I definitely did not make any specific changes for it. ...Oh, it's the Black Pits 2? Okay. I'm looking at her(?) inventory right now, and if I had to guess totally based on a whim, it may be because of her helm, the Obsidian Ioun Stone, which IIRC has a damage opcode on it in IR in order to try to prevent infinite HP exploitation as a result of the constitution bonus. I removed this opcode for IRR because it seemed to cause a number of issues (although not this particular one) and decided to simply trust players not to exploit it - if IRR works and IR doesn't, I would almost 100% guarantee that that has to be it.

[subtledoctor]

Ah, that would make sense. I have the vague feeling that I read that the EE engine actually closed that exploit. Which means maybe IR can patch the item for the EEs, and leave it as-is on the original engine. Since BP2 is EE, that would solve this.

OTOH I'm realizing that my psionics mod uses the damage opcode to remove hit points when you power psionics with hit points, rather than one of the hit point modifying opcodes. It's less than ideal because it triggers the damage animation... but even on the EE engine, I found it necessary to use opcode 12 to make the mod work correctly. Maybe Demi ran into the same issue.

As an alternative, maybe easier, could just patch the item to only apply the damage effect to party members. Enemy AI isn't going to remove and re-equip the item to exploit infinite hit points, so they don't need the damage opcode there.

[Bartimaeus]

33 minutes ago, subtledoctor said:

As an alternative, maybe easier, could just patch the item to only apply the damage effect to party members. Enemy AI isn't going to remove and re-equip the item to exploit infinite hit points, so they don't need the damage opcode there.

I disabled it for other reasons, I think because the damage opcode could trigger as being "re-equipped" at odd times, and to me, it just didn't seem worth it when players can just...decide to not cheat. If you want to use an infinite health cheat, there are easier and less tedious ways than the Obsidian Ioun Stone, that's for sure. I guess there is that certain sub-section of players out there are who basically like "if I can do it without actually opening the console, I WILL", but their "playstyle" is not really my concern, .

[grodrigues]

10 hours ago, Bartimaeus said:

which IIRC has a damage opcode on it in IR in order to try to prevent infinite HP exploitation as a result of the constitution bonus.

I have this vague memory that it was decided to replace con bonuses to a bonus to max hp precisely because of this exploit. Either I am remembering wrong or the replacement was not sweeping and complete.

[Bartimaeus]

20 minutes ago, grodrigues said:

I have this vague memory that it was decided to replace con bonuses to a bonus to max hp precisely because of this exploit. Either I am remembering wrong or the replacement was not sweeping and complete.

I'd have to think Obsidian Ioun Stone is an exception, because it would not fit in with the other +stat ioun stones if you did. I do believe it is the only exception in IR.

Edited October 7, 2021 by Bartimaeus

[subtledoctor]

4 hours ago, grodrigues said:

I have this vague memory that it was decided to replace con bonuses to a bonus to max hp precisely because of this exploit.

No, I found Demivrgvs specifically talking about how he wants to keep it as a CON bonus, and work around the infinite heal exploit. Which is annoying, because I was just about to suggest "what's the point of a CON bonus, except a few bonus hp? Why not change it to a few bonus hp?"

I just tried adding a 318 effect to block the damage from affecting EA->NOTGOOD but that doesn't solve the issue. I guess opcode 318 doesn't work for equipping effects. The best (easiest) options I can think of are:

1. change the opcode 12 effect to opcode 13 (but that comes with its own risk of bugs)
2. change the CON bonus to a hit point bonus (this would make the item more worthwhile for more characters)
3. leave the CON bonus alone and simply remove the downward hp adjustment, possibly allowing people to exploit it.
4. move the CON bonus to an .EFF, and cast a subspell that applies immunity to the .EFF for like... a minute? 30 seconds? 6 seconds? That would render the exploit so inefficient that nobody in their right mind would do it.
5. move the opcode 12 damage effect to a subspell, where an opcode 318 effect protecting NOTGOOD would be effective.

This is causing a real gameplay issue, so I think this merits making a real change to IR.  Nothing against Demi, but I really don't like this application of opcode 12 to prevent the exploit. So I would be in favor of either #2 or #3.

(Neither here nor there... the Pearly White Ioun Stone is soo out of place here. If it was my decision I would restore the Dusty Rose Ioun Stone's AC bonus, move the Luck effects to the Pearly White Ioun Stone, and make the Cloak of the Sewers work exactly as IR's current Pearly White Iuon Stone does (regen, polymorph to troll, and completely eliminate the rat and jelly polymorphs). But... that's neither here nor there.)

Edited October 7, 2021 by subtledoctor