SCS AI and SR

[Demivrgvs]

DI and IP don't prevent targets from becoming again invisible, but each round they "detect invisible" creatures. I'm not inclined to make them detectable as a True Seeing spell, as having creatures not casting spells like Mirror Image just because there's a Detect Invisibility active seems even more odd imo.

 

 

P.S Creatures failing the save against Glitterdust are also blinded (which pratically means they're doomed for 4 rounds), making the immunity to become invisible a minor effect in this case.

[aVENGER_(RR)]

Creatures failing the save against Glitterdust are also blinded (which pratically means they're doomed for 4 rounds), making the immunity to become invisible a minor effect in this case.

 

The opponents in RR (and probably SCSII as well) are not nearly as helpless while blinded as the vanilla enemies are. Furthermore, priest opponents in RR will attempt to cure afflictions such as feeblemind, blindness or deafness from their allies via Cure Disease spell.

[DavidW]

DI and IP don't prevent targets from becoming again invisible, but each round they "detect invisible" creatures. I'm not inclined to make them detectable as a True Seeing spell, as having creatures not casting spells like Mirror Image just because there's a Detect Invisibility active seems even more odd imo.

 

Interesting point. I guess it depends on your AI philosophy, but in terms of what will (a) lead to very tactically suboptimal behaviour, and (b) lead to unrealistically stupid behaviour, I think failing to recognise Detect Invisibility is more serious than overestimating it.

 

But actually, unless you're shipping DS with your mod, this isn't something you have to decide.

[SirLancelot]

I still fail to see why do you want to make a plain level 2 spell so powerful. Blindness + True sight effect is better suit for a level 6 spell or higher. Besides, what casting time would you require there? 9 seconds?

 

I can imagine everybody placing Glitterdust in all their level 2 spellbook slots.

[Salk]

You are not considering the saving throw and the limited duration of the spell and most of all, its area of effect.

 

Glitterdust is going to become powerful, no doubt but I'd not call it overpowered. In a mage's spellbook at level 2, it will compete with spells like Mirror Image, Horror and Web.

 

EDIT: Thought of 3 extremely effective Lvl2 Wizard Spells.

[SirLancelot]

You are not considering the saving throw and the limited duration of the spell and most of all, its area of effect

 

The saving throw is not a big deal until BG2, and being a level 2 spell, that actually means a tremendounsly effective top spell against mid and low level computer parties.

 

4 rounds is often time enough to slaughter the enemy without a single scratch.

 

The area of effect is the only really noticeable weak point.

 

And then, we also have the scripting problem.

 

Anyway, Demivrgvs has already stated that he wants all the spells of the same level equally useful, so besides the tactical and technical problems, i think there's a conceptual issue.

[Galactygon]

Remember that in SCS(II) most enemy mages are protected by (Minor) Globe.

 

As a compromise, something you could do is use an apply effect on condition (#272) with a force visible (#136) embedded inside. This cures normal invisibility, and renders improved invisible creatures partially visible. That still means you cannot target them with spells. Makes sense IMO.

 

-Galactygon

[SirLancelot]

Remember that in SCS(II) most enemy mages are protected by (Minor) Globe.

 

Point taken, yet thugs and BG1 mages would still see its possibilities to survive and/or attack halved.

 

As a compromise, something you could do is use an apply effect on condition (#272) with a force visible (#136) embedded inside. This cures normal invisibility, and renders improved invisible creatures partially visible. That still means you cannot target them with spells. Makes sense IMO.

 

Sounds good, Galc. However, i insist on the thieves part. We shouldn't overlook them.

 

If the proposed changes are finally done, and aVENGER and David Weider decide that is worth the hassle, i would vote for increase the spell casting time to 9 and allow a save against the blindness effect with a +2 bonus. Such bonus shall be removed as the mage level grows.

[DavidW]

David Weider

 

Is that me?

 

(I'm not Weider)

[Demivrgvs]

I'm leaving within minutes, thus I cannot work on SR anymore for at least a week, but I'm sure its current status won't give any problem (I hope! ).

 

Regarding the notorious Glitterdus few final comments. My goal wasn't to make it more powerful, I wanted to make it as per PnP, which is a more interseting spell imo, and it's how the spell probably should have been from the beginning (vanilla's description hints to this too, and there's even a unused glitterdust portrait icon I suppose it's there for this very reason).

 

That being said, SR's Glitterdust it's not more powerful than vanilla's one, as at the moment the only changes are:

- fixed to bypass SI:Div

- reduced area of effect from 30 to 10 feet radius

- save or unable to become invisible for 4 rounds

Blindness effect had a save, and still have it! In some situations SR's version may even be weaker than vanilla's one.

 

See you soon.

[SirLancelot]

Is that me?

 

(I'm not Weider)

 

Uh, yes, sorry. Wallace.

 

Blindness effect had a save, and still have it! In some situations SR's version may even be weaker than vanilla's one.

 

Yes it had, but not with a bonus to pass it.

 

I'm leaving within minutes, thus I cannot work on SR anymore for at least a week, but I'm sure its current status won't give any problem (I hope! ).

 

Enjoy!! (i presume you leave for vacation)