An idea for a new kit

[temnix]

People who make kits should sit down at a rangers' equivalent of paladins' blackguard. Call him defiler or devastator, maybe, or destroyer. Or poacher. Can take him one way, can take him another. But rangers can fall just as well as paladins, quite well even with this engine's mechanics, only there is no counterpart. Both white and green are enemies of black, and both can turn into black. Abilities might include poison, traps, turning animals into monsters or summoning them, a werewolf change for himself, an aura of corruption, an alignment change to evil for an ally. Summoning insects. Some inspiration from the dark side of nature.

I could use a kit like that for an upcoming mod. That one has to do with reputation, losing it, gaining it, falling, rising, and it would be good to go the fully monty, not only with paladins but with rangers. But I haven't made kits, and I'm busy with the other stuff.

 

[Caedwyr]

Creating your own kit is pretty simple so long as you stick to the basic projectiles and graphics.  However, I've noticed that modifying both those areas is something you seem to have a lot of experience in.  You should give it a try yourself.

[subtledoctor]

I glanced at the Complete Ranger's Handbook for inspiration and... there is nothing at all about rangers falling.  Was that something in the PHB that was never followed up on?  Or something invented for these games?  Very curious.

I should think it would be something with a whiff of death, and wildness.  Werewolf transformation is a decent idea.  Maybe a dread wolf for an animal companion - borrow Faldorn's innate summon from BG1.  Maybe some kind of Cause Disease, instead of Poison Weapon (the latter is over-done).  Cast Contagion innately?  Insect Plague as a 3rd-level spell?  Sure.

Could go another way: call it an Ash Ranger, and give it all sorts of fire-related abilities.  After some kind of trauma (watched a grove of dryads murdered, or something), the ranger is ready to burn it all down - quite literally.

[Caedwyr]

The ranger Good alignment restriction is a part of the basic class as outlined in the Player's Handbook. 

Quote

The ranger must have scores not less than 13 in Strength, 14 in Constitution, 13 in Dexterity, and 14 in Wisdom. The prime requisites of the ranger are Strength, Dexterity, and Wisdom. Rangers are always good, but they can be lawful, neutral, or chaotic. It is in the ranger's heart to do good, but not always by the rules.

Apparently there was an evil ranger kit in the Ravenloft set.  I haven't found it yet, but I did run across a couple of interesting Warrior type kits.

[Caedwyr]

Quote

Avenger

Ability Requirement: Str 15+, Dex 14+, Con 15+
Prime Requisite: Str, Con
Allowed Races: Dwarf, Half-Vistani, Human

Avengers are fighters who are driven by an almost obsessive need for revenge. At some point in their past, they witnessed a great wrong or tragedy and have dedicated themselves to seeing that those responsible, or others like them, are punished for their crimes or actions.

Ability Requirements

An avenger has spent years perfecting his physical condition and training for his war against his chosen enemy. To reflect this, his physical ability scores must be well above average. An avenger must have a Strength score of at least 15, a Dexterity score of no less than 14, and a Constitution score of 15 or better. The prime requisites for avenger characters are Strength and Constitution. If an avenger has a score of 16 or higher in both of these scores, he earns a bonus of +10% to any experience points awarded to him during the course of play.

Alignment

All avenger characters must be either neutral or chaotic. Apart from this, the alignment of avenger player characters is spread evenly between good and neutral. Only nonplayer characters can be of an evil alignment.
In general, the alignment of the avenger is the opposite of his enemy. If the character seeks revenge upon an evil person, then his alignment is good. However, a Dungeon Master could choose to have both an avenger nonplayer character and the target of his hatred to be evil.

Arms and Armor

As with the fighter, an avenger can use any type of weapon or armor available to him. Because of his intense training, he can also choose to specialize in a weapon.

Weapon Specialization
Avengers devote much of their time to training and exercise. Because of this, they have the ability to specialize in a melee weapon of their choice. Since their need for face-to-face vengeance is so great, avengers cannot choose to specialize in any type of ranged weapon.

Spells and Magical Items
Avengers, like most other warriors, cannot cast spells. They focus on their own obsession too much to devote their minds to the involved study required for spellcasting. Only the martial exercises hold any fascination for them.
Avengers use the same magical items as normal fighters. Thus, they can use all manner of magical arms, armors, and shields. In addition, they can use most magical rings, potions, and scrolls of protection.

Extra Hit Points
An avenger's focused need for revenge is such that whenever he confronts an enemy that reminds him of his nemesis in melee combat, he gains 5 hit points to help him through the encounter. This bonus increases to 10 hit points when he faces the subject of his vengeance. These hit points work exactly like the aid spell in that they are the first hit points the avenger loses when he takes damage. Once the combat is over, the extra hit points (if any) go away.

Intuition
If an avenger makes a successful Wisdom check while pursuing his foe, he intuitively "knows" which direction he should head. This ability helps an avenger by providing him with a general direction to go; it does not guide him directly to a specific location.

Basically a high stat Fighter that can specialize in melee weapons, but not ranged, and who gets extra HP and even more HP when facing a "favored enemy", plus tracking.  For BG2, I'd probably amplify the bonuses to a bit more than extra HP

[temnix]

The kit I would like to see should be really evil, not just traumatized. Like I said, one could move the concept either towards something practical, like a poacher with some traps, poison and ettercaps or spiders for allies, or spiritual, a sort of defiler type. There is another good Magic card with a representative sense of loss and devastation, Ashes to Ashes.

[Guest give it a try]

Temnix, kits are a mirror of creativity of an individual, so you cannot ask to make others a kit that you dream of.
Everyone can make a kit and it would vary according to the personal preferences. Please, release it, I'm pretty curious.

Also, are you still planning to release the summoning dead mod?

[temnix]

That's a fair point, but I'm not dreaming about this kit. I'm trying not to. I have other things to finish, and this is simply something that would round out my next mod nicely. It's all the same to me what these bad rangers would be like, so long as they were a counterpart for blackguards, sincerely bad. So anybody who decides to take up this idea, in any fashion, and makes a mod, can write to me, and I'll add compatibility with it in my next mod, about reputation. "Animate Dead Now" will be made, yes. All of the mechanics have been in place for a long time now, but there are many extras and miscellany to finish. The next mod will be a vacation from that.

[Endarire]

D&D 3.5 has the Blighter, a Druid whose powers come from destroying nature.  What about something similar for Rangers?

[temnix]

Rangers are warriors, though, not mystics. What are their powers, dual-wielding and a dog? I think I have an idea for a kit, but I'm not going to make it. I want to finish other stuff.

[Guest guest]

any chance we will see this kit of yours someday?
 

Also, I'm still looking for the resurrect dead mod by you. Is that one only for EE? Tell me no. I said subtledoctor mods, but I should have mentioned also yours, given that you seem to use EE functionality as well
 

[temnix]

Yes, only for EE. There are just too many effects and actions that don't exist in the old game. But, as I've been saying, if you are unhappy with something in EE that is not hard-coded, make a mod and change it. Or poke these other people to.

As for this kit, I don't think I'll make it. But anybody can do it. The idea was only to have an evil ranger, so the change would be simple: take the old ranger and restrict to evil alignments. It's not necessary to give him any unique abilities, but a couple of smaller ones could do. Maybe set traps like a thief, maybe poison on ranged attacks. I think "cateran" would be a nice name. That's a Scottish word for highwayman. "Marauder" is another possibility, but "cateran" has got more style. For my next mod I could actually use an evil ranger, but to venture into a whole new field - no.

[subtledoctor]

Don't quite see why a kit has to be restricted to this or that alignment, barring the few who adhere to a particular ethos, like paladins.  My mod(s) allow most rangers to be any alignment, including evil.  And some, especially the Stalker, can do stuff like set traps and use poisoned weapons.

[temnix]

Because a class has a certain nature. Rangers are virtuous protectors of the wilderness, just like paladins are virtuous protectors of civilization. Ergo, it is a special kind of ranger who is evil. Or was that a trick question?

[subtledoctor]

Capital-R Rangers are virtuous protectors of nature, and I keep them as such... but why are Archers necessarily virtuous? What does being virtuous have to do with being good with bows? Why must Stalkers or Forest Runners or Giant Killers be virtuous? One might think Greenwood Rangers, being closer to druids, should be neutral. 

One can have a bit more of an open mind about this stuff...