Graphic issues with created bam-files for items. Advice would be welcome

[Alexander12]

Hi, could anyone advise me please about bam-files.
Sometimes, when i import a new bam-file to the game, spots around the image appear:

It doesn't happen with every new image/bam. And i can't understand, on what it depends.

I don't know if i create bam-files properly, but this is my way:
1)I have a png-file painted
2)I place it on a completely black background and make bmp-file with proper size (about 55х55 px) and save with 32 bit in photoshop (i have tried another parameters, but it don't help).
3)I upload this bmp to DLTCP and make bam-file. 

It works well very often and most of the images look well. But sometimes there are black spots. As i understand, black background works as   "chromakey", and game and DLTCP delete it, but sometimes not completely.

I found a solution - i compress bmp file in MS paint to 256-colored bmp. Black spots disappear afterwards, but the quality suffers. Sometimes it is not seen, but in this case, for example, it is not pleasant:

Do you have any advice?

I have a programm bam workshop. But when i import bmp or png to it and save as BAM, DlTCP can't open it afterwards((.

Thank you

[Jarno Mikkola]

The .bmp's color 1 in it's palate... that's considered to be "invisible", as it's the transparent color. In your picture it's the black, and in the other it's the paper color... but as .bam's files don't use full color blacks in everyframe, to increase data control in a multiframe data constructs.

What you can do is use a better conversion tools. Or use a different editing one. Say BAM workshop 2.

[Sam.]

50 minutes ago, Alexander12 said:

It works well very often and most of the images look well. But sometimes there are black spots. As i understand, black background works as   "chromakey", and game and DLTCP delete it, but sometimes not completely.

For best compatibility with all games, the transparent color should be pure green RGB(0,255,0) and the shadow color (if applicable) should be pure black RGB(0,0,0).  Depending on the tool you use to turn the images into a BAM, it may be necessary to have these transparent and shadow colors located at palette entry 0 and 1 respectively in your images.

 

50 minutes ago, Alexander12 said:

I found a solution - i compress bmp file in MS paint to 256-colored bmp. Black spots disappear afterwards, but the quality suffers. Sometimes it is not seen, but in this case, for example, it is not pleasant:

I strongly discourage this.  mspaint is more powerful than many give it credit for, but its ability to accurately quantize images has always been shit.

 

50 minutes ago, Alexander12 said:

I have a programm bam workshop. But when i import bmp or png to it and save as BAM, DlTCP can't open it afterwards((.

This is suspicious.  Can you please send me the BAM that DLTCEP can't open?  Also, make sure you are using the latest version of BAMWorkshop and DLTCEP (v7.8.0.2 at the time of posting).

 

24 minutes ago, Jarno Mikkola said:

Or use a different editing one. Say BAM workshop 2.

BAMWorkshopII has its uses, but it also has many bugs which make it a real pain to use.

 

I have my suspicions about what is happening here, but without the actual images to investigate further it's hard to be sure.  If you could send me your original PNG image, the image placed on the black background, the resized image, and the BAM you created, I might can give more detailed suggestions.  However, I don't have photoshop and I don't use DLTCEP to create BAMs, so if you're looking for a step-by-step guide on how "I" would do it, it'll involve different tools.  How do you feel about command line tools?  Is this for an item icon or something else?

Edited August 6, 2020 by Sam.

[temnix]

There is nothing wrong with a 256-color palette. All of the games used only so many colors for their characters, items and backgrounds. On your example picture you simply have too few colors, period, it's not the fault of the palette. I would guess that the spots are of some very dark color that isn't quite black. You can check this inside the BAM-editing tool of Near Infinity: click on "Palette" on the first tab and select all of the black-looking squares. You may find some that are actually 5-5-5 in the channels or something like that. In that case either set them all manually to 0-0-0 (and your first color, uppermost leftmost, must be 0-0-0 too, of course), or if there are too many you can go to the last tab and lower either Brightness or Lightness. You can also set a higher transparency threshold on the first tab, to something like 10 or 15%, temporarily. Now save the image, and the near-black colors will be replaced with black, which will be removed the next time you open the image. Return the threshold to 0% or increase Brightness/Lightness by as much as you reduced it to get the rest of the colors to their normal state.

As to why these black artifacts appear, I can just tell you the procedure I use for making BAMs, which never gives me this trouble. I draw or open ready images in Microsoft Paint, then save them as PNG (actually, I have a few PNGs lying around at all times, so it's easier to just copy these and rename). These PNG files after Paint is done with them are always 24-bit color, and Near Infinity will refuse to import them, so you must first convert them in your image editor (mine is FastStone) to 256 colors. Now you can import them into Near Infinity.

[Alexander12]

On 8/7/2020 at 12:14 AM, Jarno Mikkola said:

The .bmp's color 1 in it's palate... that's considered to be "invisible", as it's the transparent color. In your picture it's the black, and in the other it's the paper color... but as .bam's files don't use full color blacks in everyframe, to increase data control in a multiframe data constructs.

What you can do is use a better conversion tools. Or use a different editing one. Say BAM workshop 2.

Thanks, yes, i have installed the latest version of Bam workshop 2. But it doesn't open PNG files:

And if i import BMB here, and save to BAM, the background in it is not transparent .

[Alexander12]

On 8/7/2020 at 12:36 AM, Sam. said:

For best compatibility with all games, the transparent color should be pure green RGB(0,255,0) and the shadow color (if applicable) should be pure black RGB(0,0,0).  Depending on the tool you use to turn the images into a BAM, it may be necessary to have these transparent and shadow colors located at palette entry 0 and 1 respectively in your images.

Thanks, i tried, but the green background doesn't disappear at all:

 

[Alexander12]

On 8/7/2020 at 12:36 AM, Sam. said:

 it may be necessary to have these transparent and shadow colors located at palette entry 0 and 1 respectively in your images.

Thanks, but i can't understand how this can be done. Is it possible to make so in DLTCP? And how? Or BAM workshop?

[Alexander12]

On 8/7/2020 at 12:36 AM, Sam. said:

This is suspicious.  Can you please send me the BAM that DLTCEP can't open?  Also, make sure you are using the latest version of BAMWorkshop and DLTCEP (v7.8.0.2 at the time of posting).

BAMWorkshopII has its uses, but it also has many bugs which make it a real pain to use.

I have my suspicions about what is happening here, but without the actual images to investigate further it's hard to be sure.  If you could send me your original PNG image, the image placed on the black background, the resized image, and the BAM you created, I might can give more detailed suggestions.  However, I don't have photoshop and I don't use DLTCEP to create BAMs, so if you're looking for a step-by-step guide on how "I" would do it, it'll involve different tools.  How do you feel about command line tools?  Is this for an item icon or something else?

Yes, thank you very much, i have sent it in message.

I have installed the latest version of BAM workshop, and DLTCP open files from it now, but it's background  is not transparent(.

Command line tools? You mean WEIDU? Oh, this is a dark wood  for me now.

Yes, this is an icon for inventory item. 

[Jarno Mikkola]

16 minutes ago, Alexander12 said:

Thanks, but i can't understand how this can be done. Is it possible to make so in DLTCP? And how? Or BAM workshop?

Well, you can view the Palette in Near Infinity. You find the file in the BAM folder, you push Edit BAM, and you then find the frame, and then you push Palette. Sam might know easier way, and other tools...

3 minutes ago, Alexander12 said:

Yes, this is an icon for inventory item. 

In which game ? It might help a lot to know. Cause if it's BG1... that cou..

Edited August 8, 2020 by Jarno Mikkola

[Alexander12]

10 minutes ago, Jarno Mikkola said:

Well, you can view the Palette in Near Infinity. You find the file in the BAM folder, you push Edit BAM, and you then find the frame, and then you push Palette. Sam might know easier way, and other tools...

In which game ? It might help a lot to know. Cause if it's BG1... that cou..

Thanks, i'll try.

I am making items for BG1 EE+SOD, and BG2 EE.

[Alexander12]

13 hours ago, temnix said:

There is nothing wrong with a 256-color palette. All of the games used only so many colors for their characters, items and backgrounds. On your example picture you simply have too few colors, period, it's not the fault of the palette. I would guess that the spots are of some very dark color that isn't quite black. You can check this inside the BAM-editing tool of Near Infinity: click on "Palette" on the first tab and select all of the black-looking squares. You may find some that are actually 5-5-5 in the channels or something like that. In that case either set them all manually to 0-0-0 (and your first color, uppermost leftmost, must be 0-0-0 too, of course), or if there are too many you can go to the last tab and lower either Brightness or Lightness. You can also set a higher transparency threshold on the first tab, to something like 10 or 15%, temporarily. Now save the image, and the near-black colors will be replaced with black, which will be removed the next time you open the image. Return the threshold to 0% or increase Brightness/Lightness by as much as you reduced it to get the rest of the colors to their normal state.

As to why these black artifacts appear, I can just tell you the procedure I use for making BAMs, which never gives me this trouble. I draw or open ready images in Microsoft Paint, then save them as PNG (actually, I have a few PNGs lying around at all times, so it's easier to just copy these and rename). These PNG files after Paint is done with them are always 24-bit color, and Near Infinity will refuse to import them, so you must first convert them in your image editor (mine is FastStone) to 256 colors. Now you can import them into Near Infinity.

Thank you, i'll try.

[Alexander12]

14 hours ago, temnix said:

There is nothing wrong with a 256-color palette. All of the games used only so many colors for their characters, items and backgrounds. On your example picture you simply have too few colors, period, it's not the fault of the palette. I would guess that the spots are of some very dark color that isn't quite black. You can check this inside the BAM-editing tool of Near Infinity: click on "Palette" on the first tab and select all of the black-looking squares. You may find some that are actually 5-5-5 in the channels or something like that. In that case either set them all manually to 0-0-0 (and your first color, uppermost leftmost, must be 0-0-0 too, of course), or if there are too many you can go to the last tab and lower either Brightness or Lightness. You can also set a higher transparency threshold on the first tab, to something like 10 or 15%, temporarily. Now save the image, and the near-black colors will be replaced with black, which will be removed the next time you open the image. Return the threshold to 0% or increase Brightness/Lightness by as much as you reduced it to get the rest of the colors to their normal state.

As to why these black artifacts appear, I can just tell you the procedure I use for making BAMs, which never gives me this trouble. I draw or open ready images in Microsoft Paint, then save them as PNG (actually, I have a few PNGs lying around at all times, so it's easier to just copy these and rename). These PNG files after Paint is done with them are always 24-bit color, and Near Infinity will refuse to import them, so you must first convert them in your image editor (mine is FastStone) to 256 colors. Now you can import them into Near Infinity.

Yes, that is absolutely so. If an image has many colours, everything is Ok. But if it has a few colours, then spots appear.

[Alexander12]

Thanks to everyone, now, when latest version of BAM work works properly, i just erased those spots. 

I don't know if this is the best way, but i guess it will will go for now.  Pity that edges of the cloack are not very good. I don't know if there are proper tools in BAM workshop to fix it, like in Photoshop.

Edited August 8, 2020 by Alexander12

[temnix]

Dude, just do like I told you. Open your cloak in Paint, flood the background with white for the black edge to stand out, remove the edge carefully with the pencil tool. Now save the image as PNG, exit Paint, convert the PNG to 256 colors and import it into Near Infinity's BAM editor. Forget BAM Workshop.

[Alexander12]

11 hours ago, temnix said:

Dude, just do like I told you. Open your cloak in Paint, flood the background with white for the black edge to stand out, remove the edge carefully with the pencil tool. Now save the image as PNG, exit Paint, convert the PNG to 256 colors and import it into Near Infinity's BAM editor. Forget BAM Workshop.

Couldn't you tell me please, which of these tools in Near infinity can do it and where is BAM editor here? I can't find this option.