Suggestions for BG2 ***SPOILERS***

[berelinde]

One rule: nothing about family matters.

 

There's a separate thread for that. Click here to view that thread.

[cmorgan]

To be taken with a grain of salt and several doses of wariness, because I am *not* the best player out there (I am *way* too goody-two-shoes) and of course I am chicken, so I will do a "fire and forget" and then go away, so I am not "spoiled":

 

Suggestion 1 > "stability option". Either a way to give Gavin a steady sense of home and place via a Stronghold-like quest (or a Stronghold/community to serve), or a quest that gives him contacts so that the "after story" doesn't leave him hanging out at the end of ToB with no place to go if PC fairest decides to take Goddesshood; a place for them to retire to that is equally his if they decide to stay together. Most of all, a permanent tie-up solution to the whole childrearing thing, indepent of Mistress Player1 and her designs on the future!

 

Suggestion 2 > Gavin's character is well defined and complete, so there is no need for stats adjustment (and there are plenty of ingame items he can use), so I do not suggest that he be given items or upgrades - I think it would not make sense for his character to gain power those ways. His power comes from actual characterization and roleplay immersion. There are enough items in the game to make him phenomenal (toss him CT or a Belt and he will tank *and* clean up on spells).

 

Suggestion 3> Stop taking suggestions, and start writing, oh dialogue princess - you have too many suggestions already, and if you take much more, your head will explode, and then we will *never* see the ToB portion!!!!!!!!!!!

[berelinde]

Point taken.

 

But you never know where you'll find a gem. With lots of friendship talks and lovetalks still to go, there's room for player input. My rule for BG1 was 4-5 storyline driven talks in a row, then a lighter talk to keep the NPC-PC relationship from falling into a rut. Those "nonsequeter talks" all came from player suggestions.

[cmorgan]

I was just attempting a friendly "busting your chops", berelinde - I am just lousy at it, and trying to get a backhanded-style compliment in on the internet, erm... mell, it kinda ends up looking more "backhand" than "compliment" - so I will go back to my usual style

 

The good news about "too many ideas" is that they can generate whole new mods, so there is really no harm in coming up with ideas, no matter how random or different - they will be useful ome day, in some game, on some game enging or other. On that note:

 

a real suggestion #3 -

 

Friendship track, my buddy Gavin needs to settle down, and I am jonesing to see some romance talk (but still getting over my whole "play a female PC" thing). I humbly suggest Gavin Romance possibilities with the following:

 

Aerie - good conflict, knightly sparring, but you *know* Gavin is a sucker for a person in need - and hijacking her romance dialogues with him means that lots of the romance from her end is partially rewritten. I would pay cash (literally) to see Aerie's dialogues modified to a mature relationship, and Gavin is the dudue to do it.

 

Jaheira - no way. Same class as Anomen and Minsc. Can't see it. But then again, you have lived with Gavin for years - perhaps he might?

 

Viconia - just joking!!!!! (though I hope he and kivan gang up on her and put her out of harms way, into the "loving" embrace of her dark gods...)

 

Taisha - problem of permissions, and she is definitely tailore to a Bhaalspawn PC, but still, it is a possibility.

 

Imoen.

 

Imoen.

 

Hmmm...

 

Cute, check.

 

Damaged, check check.

 

Available, check check check.

 

Adds to story incentive to finish Spellhold early, check, check, check, check.

 

Adds romance to a woman who desparately needs a BG2 character lift to approximate her BG1 NPC-built character, Check X 5.

 

Hmmmmmmm.....

[berelinde]

And you want it done when?

 

He never thought of her that way in BG1 because she had a lot of growing up to do. In BG2, that's a different story...

 

About Aerie: I had originally considered a possible romance arc, but discarded the idea for several reasons. One is that Aerie's story is very complex, and as much as I'd like to see her get some healing in BG2, Aklon's a better man for the job. Also, my take on Aerie might not be compatible with many people's opinions. I see her as inherently childlike, but still with a healthy dose of childish manipulation. That won't sit well with Gavin.

 

Imoen is just a kid in BG1, but in BG2, she grows up the hard way, fast. And she'd definitely keep Gavin on his toes (thinking about the Keldorn banter here--I can just see Gavin's eyes popping out of his skull). We'll have to see. I do want to finish this mod eventually.

[Ajnos]

And you want it done when?

 

He never thought of her that way in BG1 because she had a lot of growing up to do. In BG2, that's a different story...

 

Seriously? I really have no interest in NPC-NPC romances. The original NPCs don't really do that, Haer/Aerie aside. Why (not just Gavin either) are new NPCs always so very special that they simply must be loved by someone? Yeah, I could romance him myself, but if I don't every.single.time. then I have to sit through him and Imoen cooing if I want to have them both in the party?

 

 

Edit: Write what you want though, of course. I just can't help notice how so many male NPC romances have backup plans, Aklon/Darian/Kelsey/Gavin.

[cmorgan]

good points...

 

so the option via PID or banter responses to have Imoen and Gavin "cool it", perhaps?

 

Ajnos does not need to sit through the stuff, but as I've found out reading other folks' mods there is a huge amount of content that a player will never see, even on runthrough after runthrough. I see alternate romances as a way for an author to allow more content into a game in a relatively non-intrusive way. So the alternative is to let the PC take some control of his/her little sister (and who wouldn't - I was away, but my brother waited up the first night our little sister (16, mind you) came home from her first big date, making sure he was cleaning his sidearm in the front room as they came in [subtle he ain't; but it got the message across that whatever was cool with my sister, ok; hurt her and you are a dead man) and guide the dialogue the way the player wants.

 

I like the NPC/NPC thing because it seems to make sense to me (while the Hero[ine] gets the whole story, I was one who was always ticked off that other folks in the party didn't get all mushy. Imoen/Garrick have flash and then nothig, Keto and Yoshimo talk alot and have alot in common (on the surface) but never spark.

 

I agree about Aerie, berelinde, come to think about it. Not as good a fit when you take the whole thing into consideration, and Aklon does have that avenue covered. But I do think it is an interesting way to bring Imoen into the story (without (apologies to the authors, but it is really not my cup of tea) the Imoen Romance.

[Ajnos]

I like the NPC/NPC thing because it seems to make sense to me (while the Hero[ine] gets the whole story, I was one who was always ticked off that other folks in the party didn't get all mushy. Imoen/Garrick have flash and then nothig, Keto and Yoshimo talk alot and have alot in common (on the surface) but never spark.

 

On the other hand why would they make kissy faces in front of the PC anyway? Bad enough the PC romance is apparently some performance art piece for the party to comment on, but now the NPCs are doing the same?* But whatever, I simply don't like it NPC-NPC romances and I doubt I ever will. ... Okay, I'm done.

 

 

*Yeah, I know there is no real alternatives to conflict or whatever. Though I like seeing how various mods try to compromise with the party is here/over there/right here and we should run away from the party to mack... very fun.

[berelinde]

Kind of like the option for a banter to start, and give PC a chance to pull the plug on it either during the course of it, or via PID afterward.

 

Oddly enough, my brother did the same thing once when he didn't like the guy I was dating. Brothers are like that.

 

Edit: *If* I decide to go there, and that's a mighty big "if," I prefer the way Auren's romance handled NPC-NPC interaction: the only thing the PC ever sees is chit-chat. Anything else is presumably handled off-camera.

 

Yet another edit: Also, *if* I decide to go there, he wouldn't be interested in anyone else if the PC was an eligible female of any race.

[Kulyok]

Seriously? I really have no interest in NPC-NPC romances. The original NPCs don't really do that, Haer/Aerie aside. Why (not just Gavin either) are new NPCs always so very special that they simply must be loved by someone? Yeah, I could romance him myself, but if I don't every.single.time. then I have to sit through him and Imoen cooing if I want to have them both in the party?

 

 

Edit: Write what you want though, of course. I just can't help notice how so many male NPC romances have backup plans, Aklon/Darian/Kelsey/Gavin.

 

I quite agree here. Couldn't have said better myself.

 

(Keto-Yoshimo is an exception for me, because she is not interested in PC, she has serious troubles of her own, and while she is warming up to Kelsey and Yoshimo, it is not exactly a romance(though she may love Yoshimo, and probably does) - and it is clear she still has a long way to go and find herself, before... before.)

 

Besides, Gavin has stat requirements. Can you imagine how insulting it might be to the female PC if he would romance Nalia in PC's face, because PC's charisma is only 11? Shallow is an understatement.

 

As well, from what I remember from my BG run, Gavin isn't there to find a girlfriend, not specifically - he is there to find some money for his daughter's education, and, later, to help PC. And he still has this daughter in BG2. And there's still a big question of whether Imoen, Aerie, Nalia or Mazzy would romance a single father.

 

So my suggestion will be "No Gavin-NPC romance".

[Eleima]

As well, from what I remember from my BG run, Gavin isn't there to find a girlfriend, not specifically - he is there to find some money for his daughter's education, and, later, to help PC. And he still has this daughter in BG2. And there's still a big question of whether Imoen, Aerie, Nalia or Mazzy would romance a single father.

 

So my suggestion will be "No Gavin-NPC romance".

I don't think I can say it any better than Kulyok, so I guess I won't try.

I will say this though, I agree wholeheartedly with what Kulyok wrote. Knowing Gavin from what I learned through my BG1 runs with him, I just can't see him romancing Imoen, Aerie, Nalia or Mazzy, and even less Jaheira. The way I picture it (rightly or wrongly), Gavin is adventuring because and for Lanie, and that his romance with the PC is an "accident" of sorts. Meaning that it's something he hadn't planned upon, that just sorta happened, and that he had to give in to, or his love for the PC would've driven him mad.

But then again, that's just me.

[berelinde]

Still not committing to a decision, but I do want to comment that there is a subtle beauty to WeiDU. It allows modders to segment a mod into as many components as are desired. There's nothing to say that such a thing couldn't be a separate component, to be installed or not at the player's discretion.

 

No, my reason has nothing to do with Gavin's personality. I don't think there's a romanceable character out there that *is* looking for love, exactly, but they all do find themselves there, nonetheless. The reason I'm still on the fence is time. I don't want to slow things down too much.

 

So at this point, my take on this particular possibility is "wait and see."

[KIrving]

*bump*

 

May contain Gavin spoilers.

 

 

 

 

 

I'm sure this has been said before, however I can really see Gavin having quite a difficult time in the underdark. No dawn, no daylight, acts of cruelty, a lot of fighting and close proximity to objects of phobia. I think that Gavin could need comforting while travelling through here (or cover up his own discomfort by comforting his companions) and of course, the drow city will be confronting.

I can imagine him possibly having a crisis of faith or maybe some, waking up, post nightmare talks.

 

Also in the drow city will he have a comment/reaction in the outside area that has slaves/prisoners being 'fed on'?(the spider area)

[berelinde]

Only one breakdown per game, I think. There's something rather traumatic that happens a bit later in the game that affects his faith more negatively. But that would be telling.

 

He's not going to be happy in the Underdark, true, and is likely going to have very definite opinions about the slave pens. And you're right. It would be in character for him to combat his own insecurity by attempting to comfort others. Good idea!

[close2myheart]

*de-lurk mode on*

 

Hiya ,

 

Dunno if this has been mentioned or not, but I'll just fire away anyways.

In the ToB, when the party was on a journey to Amkethram, the journey was somewhat intercepted by Tethyr armed forces (led by a general whose name escapes me ) and they were being accompanied by clerics of Lathander

 

How will Gavin reacts to this? I don't think it sits well with him that the PC (and the rest of the group) lawn mowed those people who shares the same profession and faith as he does, although he knows that the opposing party gave them no choice

 

Would he try to:

- Persuade his fellow Lathandrites that he vouch for the PC's character, that they are on the same side ..

- Persuade PC at all cost to avoid bloodshed with the Tethyr authority ..

...etc (y'know, those kinda stuff )

 

Oh, and btw... I'm one of those that actually likes NPC-NPC romance (I guess I'm a minority here ) It's just kinda nice to see the other companions also have a life of their own so everything is not just about the almighty bhaalspawn

 

 

*back to lurk mode again*