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What people find boring in Chateau Irenicus


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8. So... how do you get back there? And as an interesting aside... is the dungeon's main entrance meant to be the explodified bit of Waukeen's Promenade? That doesn't really work.

Yes, it is interesting. It is also odd that Athkatla, a city of riches, can't seem to fund the reconstruction of the Promenade. If someone wanted to put in the work, couldn't it be handled just like the Temple Ruins exterior map? Perhaps set a timer after leaving the Promenade the first time and having a new, fixed area appear after a given time. Or, have it fixed after you emerge from the Underdark. I know Lady Alustriel took the the Promenade scene and rotated it--fixing the damaged area, IIRC. I'm not sure how useful the .bmp would be, though. ;)

I have actually thought about this for months yet failed to mention it. The best explanation here is "Unfinished Business" ~ yet again. ;)



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1. what sim said: DBG lets you skip through CI if you hate, but you still got through it. what's left of the narrative of SOA if you get out of CI unscathed? what's left if you take the elevator out of CI *and then* imoen gets arrested by the CW. for what, dropping litter? the SOA plot is weak enough as it is, without punching bigger holes in it.


2. BP adds constantly spawning bugbears and shadowthief bands. makes it tougher *and* more consistent. BP also adds some continuity to the Illyich encounter, too. BP also adds extra otyughs and ogres, and makes duergars *tough*.


3. see 7.


4. it'd be nice, but would have to be hard: if yr attacking someone's stronghold, you'd need pretty convincing evidence that someone coming out *wasnt* one of the defenders.


5. boss battle: TDD and BP add a fairly tough (for low-level chars) battle at the end with ettins and (i think) ogres - my party usually staggers out of CI barely alive after that.


7. Chloe - found in the air pocket (yay! use for the air pocket!); Kachiko (added by TS/BP) - found at the end of CI. already you've got a party of 7...

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1. I personally have no need of skipping areas.


2. Irenicus doesn't need minions. He's a proud and powerful mage, after all. What few people he has around are either guests or servants. The vampire is one of Bodhi's girls, so in hindsight I'm not surprised to find her there, especially since the dungeon is connected to the city's underground sewer system. The 'doppelganger' was probably supposed to be a rakshasa, but Frennedan's DLG file has this option disabled, and since he's trapped behind a glass wall, it would seem that he's just another test subject. The duergar probably helped Jon tunnel out the place. The humans are probably all dead or dying from his experiments, just as the party was going to be had the Shadow Thieves not distracted Irenicus.


This game is already made somewhat boring by the sheer amount of combat, so making things 'tougher' and adding more enemies isn't necessarily the answer. While the Icewind Dale series rewards the player who talks his way out of a fight, and provides numerous opportunities (at least in 2), BG2 doesn't, and provides few opportunities. IWD2 still rewards the player if the dialog breaks down into combat, but you at least tried to talk your way out of it. In all cases, the experience reward is worth more than what you get in combat. I wouldn't mind seeing more of this in BG2, rather than more forced combat.


3. Sticking a party-joinable NPC in the plane of air map is an okay idea (not my first choice), but removing a step or two from the fedex quest of getting the sword would suffice as well. If you meet the dryads first and told them you were trying to help people escape from Irenicus, they could offer you the genie's lamp and tell you he was being help captive too, then when you went to visit the genie, you'd already have his lamp. One trip and you're done.


4. I think it could be made doable if you let Yoshimo join, then the Shadow Thieves could recognize him thanks to his recent run-ins with Renal Bloodscalp, and assume that the rest of the party was somehow involved in Yoshimo's misadventures. Perhaps they'd let you go with a warning to leave immediately because any treasure belonged to them, or something. A decent charisma couldn't hurt.


5. I agree with Sim. You're supposed to leave the dungeon without any fanfare, perhaps thinking that you're going to get away easy for a change, and end up right in the middle of a mage battle, with the end result being that both Irenicus and Imoen disappear, and you were powerless to do anything. I like it just the way it is.


6. There's already a foreshadowing of sorts, though a dialog bug may prevent it. If you talk Rielev up to the point where you can 'release', or kill, him and then refuse to do it, Imoen is supposed to impulsively step forward and take the crystal, killing Rielev, then muse over his death for a few moments. "Death is beautiful..."


7. The only way I'd do this, atm, is by providing a means of picking up Khalid's body and taking him to a healer as soon as you escape. It's already easy enough to form a full party in most cases. Also, I'd expect to find more NPCs in public places than I would in dank dungeons. I mean, we already have Imoen, Minsc, Jaheira and Yoshimo (and possibly a modded-in Khalid) in CI (underground), Mazzy in a underground temple ruin, Cernd in an underground jail, and Haer'dalis in an underground laboratory. ;)


8. According to the damage visible in the promenade, the only part of CI that collapsed is the exit to the surface. I was thinking it might be viable that the entrance was via a sewer grate, as CI proper appears to end at a sewer system, and Aran later reveals finding dead bodies in the sewer outlets (or thereabout). The north end of the sewer tunnel is caved-in, but what about the south end?

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