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RE for BG I?


Vigdis

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Well, it just shows that computer gaming fails as an art form. Killing shouldn't be trivial unless the game is deliberately sociopathic, like GTA or Carmageddon.

Like how you in BG can get into a fight with mercenaries, and noone gives a damn, but steal from a shopkeeper, and you're the scourge of Amn?

I don't understand your train of thought.

*Sigh* Bad explanation, then. I tried to state that they always (as far as I know) put a *censor* on possible "romantic" things.. IF that even takes part in a game. Without the flirt packs and RE, we would have nothing but talk, talk and talk. Killing, not much so. Some games are very graphic and detailed as far to what you do with a victim.

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Well, it just shows that computer gaming fails as an art form. Killing shouldn't be trivial unless the game is deliberately sociopathic, like GTA or Carmageddon.

Like how you in BG can get into a fight with mercenaries, and noone gives a damn, but steal from a shopkeeper, and you're the scourge of Amn?

I meant mostly how it feels, not the external consequences. The main problem is that death is often pretty ugly - decapitation, disembowelment, dismemberment, bleeding, brain splashing around, death throes, etc., etc., etc.

And PC is just a civilian.

People in BG die too cleanly and too quickly. The only point where the PC seems to be able to give a damn about it is in the beginning, but the killing itself doesn't really feel significant, which makes the dialogue options feel artificial.

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The PC is, however, a civilian in a world where war is a much more common event than in our lives, and is a lot more up close and personal when it happens. And given that the PC can be a trained warrior, civilian is possibly not an acurate term.

 

Now the PC is also a sheltered person, I'll admit, but in a world where meat doesn't come in the supermarket and you have to kill, butcher and clean it all yourself (or see it done often enough), then seeing the inside of someone's guts as you kill them likely doesn't add much to the horror of just having killed another sentient being. Assuming your character feels any at all, of course.

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Candlekeep has it's own cooks.

lol, I don't think that was the point... :)

 

I grew up in a very rural setting and we hunted/butchered our own meat, and while I was not the "cook" I was part of the slaughtering/skinning/gutting process. As a kid in that type of setting, that is part of life, part of the chores that are normal for kids in that area, so I find that I'm not as sensitive to "gore" as most other people. I don't like seeing guts and blood, but it doesn't much bother me either. I imagine killing a person plays more upon the morality of the PC (or, as BigRob pointed out, lack of morality) and not so much upon the "horror" of seeing a bloody corpse.

 

Also, and perhaps this is merely the way that I roleplay the PC, but I find it a big stretch to imaging a Bhaalspawn that's really bothered by death. True that they don't know what they are at the beginning, but murder is in their blood. I don't think of them running around in a mindless state of bloodlust, and it doesn't mean they can't feel some sense of regret for killing, I just can't imagine a child of the god of murder passing out at the sight of some guts on the floor. A squeamish Bhaalspawn just doesn't make sense to me. :)

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I grew up in a very rural setting and we hunted/butchered our own meat, and while I was not the "cook" I was part of the slaughtering/skinning/gutting process. As a kid in that type of setting, that is part of life, part of the chores that are normal for kids in that area, so I find that I'm not as sensitive to "gore" as most other people. I don't like seeing guts and blood, but it doesn't much bother me either. I imagine killing a person plays more upon the morality of the PC (or, as BigRob pointed out, lack of morality) and not so much upon the "horror" of seeing a bloody corpse.

Yeah, but in Baldur's Gate, killing anything doesn't even feel like killing anything - even killing a fly feels more significant than killing a "human" in BG - simply NPC don't feel like something that lives and that something that wants to stay alive, even in their final moments - that doesn't even leave room for morality or lack of it - NPCs are so totally subhuman and artificial, that killing them is like kicking a dummy. And their death/wound sounds sound more like bedroom sounds :) .

 

There's also the question of being dirty, blood spattered and all the other unpleasantness of adventuring life.

 

But hey, harlots are too horrible in comparison to that.

 

Also, and perhaps this is merely the way that I roleplay the PC, but I find it a big stretch to imaging a Bhaalspawn that's really bothered by death. True that they don't know what they are at the beginning, but murder is in their blood. I don't think of them running around in a mindless state of bloodlust, and it doesn't mean they can't feel some sense of regret for killing, I just can't imagine a child of the god of murder passing out at the sight of some guts on the floor. A squeamish Bhaalspawn just doesn't make sense to me. :)

Yes, but in BG death doesn't mean anything. Even the whole Bhaalspawn thing doesn't do a good job at haunting the PC until she gets her soul stolen. There aren't any real situations in BG where the PC would be tempted by their blood.

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For Mysteries of the Sword Coast mod, I wrote one romantic encounter with... Phlydia. It occurs after her mini-quest, and she wants to give a little gift for a boy, who's going from home and go wander... and you're ending in Dreppin's barn - where of course, he catches u 'at the moment'. Dialogue is written more to be funny and happy (nearly you know, idyllic picture of villageboy's first sex-contacts, which have to occur in barn. :))

 

BG1 is more 'happy-go-luck' adventure game than BG2, so when you will change a bit your writing style to fit BG1 standard, it can also be a fun. Mhm. Describing sex scenes in BG1 will not be fine, but in BG2 sometimes also was a bit... uhm, sorry to say that, but dull. When in original game there's no so well described dialogues-things, why these one are? It doesn't fit to big picture of whole game I think. But sorry - I do like mods which could be mistaken with true BG.

 

Romantic Encounters for BG1 can be possible. Zed Nocear, creator of Mysteries of Sword Coast wanted to do something like that (not ROMANTIC ENCOUNTER with him!). And even we had few nice ideas.

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I've read all your pros and contras about RE for BG1. I'd like the idea of RE for BG1 and think much gamers, too. What was the success of BGQE of Jastey? It is not combat oriented, but gives the villages and towns in BG1 much more live. Gamers like that and with more live in BG1 it grows bigger and bigger. So the gamer has several options with the different mods.

 

BGQE for little quests and situations with humans in villages and towns.

BG1NPC Project for the live of the existing NPCs, with encounters, quests and romances.

BG1RE for situations which the other both mods not covered. The gamer/HC has the possibility to flirt or do more with some peoples around the sword coast.

 

If you travel through BG1, much time passes and much happens with the HC. Why he shouldn't do a romantic encounter... Each step is dangerous and if the HC have a chance to can forget this for awile (like a whole night), then he will try or do it.

 

Only my opinion. :)

 

Greetings Leomar

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I'd like to throw my anonymous hat into the ring for a BG1 RE.

If I could write I'd try it myself, but I'm afraid I'm just one chimp with one typewriter and won't be producing Shakespeare any time soon.

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I have to say that there's a few characters I could imagine being able to come up with a scene or two for, from the original BG game, but I have neither the time nor the ability to do much about it unfortunately. But isn't that always the way? :)

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Oh, yeah! "Gorion the pedophile", "Rape Imoen", "Sarevok: sex before dying", "Tamoko: orgasm and betrayal", "BDSM with Davaeorn: a REAL low".

 

Sorrow and Black_Raven would be proud.

 

(I had to check the spelling for "orgasm". Haven't used _that_ part of English language for a long while, it seems. ...Oh, man. Don't let jastey see this.)

 

 

Seriously, apart from the fact I'm in the middle of a book(The Book, uh-huh),

the math is really simple: (BG2 mod downloads per month)=(BG1 mod dls per month)*5. Apart from the lack of Saemon Havarian(who looks really, really awful in BG1 fics) and Renal Bloodscalp and Aran Linvail... yeah, I think it matters.

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Oh, yeah! "Gorion the pedophile", "Rape Imoen", "Sarevok: sex before dying", "Tamoko: orgasm and betrayal", "BDSM with Davaeorn: a REAL low".

 

Eh, not quite :) there's enough 'minor' characters who have a name beyond 'peasant' or 'commoner' to interest me, and it's them I was thinking of, and less the actual 'story' characters.

 

But no matter :)

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(I had to check the spelling for "orgasm"...)

:):)

 

I think the combination of less romantic possibilities + less popularity (BG1 mods vs. BG2 mods) + no one willing to actually start such a project = never going to happen. Not that it's a bad idea, but it seems the odds are stacked against it from the start.

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Agrees - you could kill twice in the Prologue (not counting the rats) and then you are hunted and have to kill your way out of those encounters and a few others besides, add the loss of your 'father' AND you have the voice of Bhall nagging at you - I'd be a wee bit confused and unsure at all of this.

Good job you weren't the child of a deity like say, Aphrodite...

:)

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As for going all the way into darkness...

They already went all the way - my PC had over 500 kills when I finished the game and often lost the whole party. It would make him/her an insane butcher.

That's true, but ain't it like that always, both in games and tv in general? Take a common action movie. Unless the person that kills someone does it in a really sick way, noone usually cares. In most games, you can kill something or someone, it's just another day at the computer. You *cannot* take it to the bedchambers. Maybe you can, but it's rare. I know no such games.

 

I am annoyed that in Video Games (PC, Xbox, etc), whether rated T (Teens) or M (Mature), the "sex" aspect is toned down, but it is alright to be a serial murderer and hack-and-slash opponents by the hundreds. Is the rating agency saying voilence is OK, but nudity is not? Philosophically and pyschologically, there is something wrong with that. I would rather have it the other way around, i.e. have more nudity in Games, and have the Gore and Voilence toned down (or even cartoonish).

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