a mod idea: removable spellbooks and greater general risk of being pickpocketed

[Lemernis]

Warning: Just file this whole discussion under the category "hey, wouldn't it be neat if this could be done". Sorry if I get a little carried away as I run with the idea:

 

In the IWD-in-BG2 forum the idea came up that spellbooks might somehow be made into real physcial items in the inventory that can be removed from the mage's possession.

 

If or how that might be done, I cannot say, not being a coder myself. But if it is codeable it does offer some intriguing possibilities for gameplay.

 

A mod that introduces the feature that the mage's spellbook can be removed from his possession--and offers a substantial risk that this will indeed happen--certainly affects how the game is played. The loss of a spellbook at a critical time could be devastating to the party's progress. Protection of mages and their spellbooks becomes crucial to strategy throughout the game.

 

Blank spellbooks would be available for sale in magic shops. But I would make them rather costly. Given that such enormous wealth is accumulated during the course of the game, money sinks arguably serve to improve play balance.

 

In the case of Irenicus dungeon, I would make it so that the spellbook has been destroyed, i.e., it is irretrievable. The mage then has to start over with a brand new, blank spellbook available at Adventurer's Mart (for a pretty penny).

 

Also, throughout the game, if a mage is incapciated in some way during a battle (panicked, unconscious, confused, stunned, etc.) enemy rogues could steal the spellbook from their gear. Even during the heat of battle I think this is feasible, given the general confusion.

 

In addition, spellbooks could be subject to being pickpocketed. The greatest danger of this happening should be anywhere that there is a high level of distraction and a lot of people. On any big city street, for example. Also in any tavern, circus, eg, anywhere that's noisy and where people might jostle up against one another. There should probably be a higher incidence of such thieves at night.

 

Some players would probably consider something like this a gigantic nuisance factor. But in that case the mod (or mod component) just wouldn't be for them.

 

Please indulge me as I brainstorm what this might entail.

 

As for removal of a spellbook, let's first look at the spellbook's function in gameworld

 

Make spellbook into an item that can be removed from inventory

 

I'll proceed on the assumption that this is doable.

 

First it should be noted that spell memorization for mages is designed around game mechanics versus realism. Here is the role of the spellbook:

 

BGII manual:

 

First, a Mage can only use spells from his spell book. Beginning Mages start with only a few basic spells; over time, they obtain spell scrolls to add to their magical knowledge... A Mage’s mind can comprehend only a certain number of spells. The number of spells he can have in his book is limited by his Intelligence. Ultimately, it is daily spell memorization that is most important. Every day, the Mage must memorize spells from his spellbook. To draw on magical energy, the Mage must shape specific mental patterns in his mind. He uses his spell book to force his mind through mental exercises, preparing it to hold the final twisted patterns. This process is called memorization. Once a Mage memorizes a spell, it remains in his memory (as potential energy) until he uses the prescribed words, motions, and components to trigger the release of the energy. Upon casting, the energy of the spell is spent, wiped clean from the Mage's mind--lost until the Mage studies and memorizes that spell again. The number of spells a Mage can memorize is given by his level; he can memorize the same spell more than once, but each memorization counts as one spell toward his daily memorization limit. Memorization is not a thing that happens immediately. The Mage must have a clear head gained from a restful night's sleep and then must spend time studying his spell book. Spells remain memorized until they are cast or wiped from the character's mind at the spell memorization screen.

 

On the one hand, the manual states that memorization is required "daily," and that the spellbook would be required for this. But on the other hand, it states that once the memorization has been performed the memorized spell remains as potential energy in the mind virtually forever until discharged.

 

So as I read the manual, if the the mage is without his spellbook he should be able to use only spells that were last memorized. And once those spells are discharged, he would be be unable to cast except via scrolls, upon retrieving his spellbook, or upon starting over with a blank spellbook.

 

He could also use wands or other magical items that cast spells.

 

NPC mages' spellbooks are also made available

 

If the party is subject to losing a mage's spellbook, then the enemy should be also. Ideally, anyway. I'm just not sure if the game engine requires that spells be manually learned, one at a time.

 

But if spells do not have to be manually learned individually, by all means have enemy mages drop their spellbooks. And make it so that neutral (or charmed) mages' spellbook can be pickpocketed. Spellbooks could be found squirreled away in locked chests and cabinets.

 

The spell selections could run the gamut. A transmuter might have mostly spells from his own school, etc.

 

Perhaps some readymade spellbooks could also be available for sale. But this would be low level stuff. Anything really good would be jealously guarded and not for sale.

 

Pickpocketing increased in general

 

I'm envisioning a mod wherein the danger of being pickpocketed is greatly increased across the board.

 

Particularly in big cities there would be an increased instance of true class thieves spawning randomly who pickpocket. Lots of the goodies that the party relies on that go unequipped would be at risk. And this of course includes also the bag of holding--an extremely high value, coveted target for any thief.

 

There would be a range of levels/pickpocketing ability for these true class thieves.

 

In addition the mod would introduce a specialized type of enemy thief pickpocket who specificaly goes after magical items. This type of thief is particularly interested in spellbooks, but might randomly be tempted to steal a magical item as well.

 

The pickpocket either succeeds or fails, i.e fails if the target makes its saving throw. When it fails, the enemy flees. True class thieves gulp down a potion of invisibility and oil of speed and run. Mage-thief pickpockets can use a variety of spells to try to escape. If they are killed before they can get away have them drop some nice loot (magical items for the mage-thieves).

 

If it were in some kind of 'real world', the party would be most vulnerable to being pickpockted when their attention is distracted, eg, when a NPC talking to them out on the city streets. When the party is talking to someone on the street the target's saving throw versus pickpocket could be lowered. If the player is fully roleplaying he'll allow the first pickpocket to happen; likely afterward he'll take precations to protect against it.

 

Mage-Thief pickpockets

 

It isn't hard to imagine mage-thieves who specialize in stealing spellbooks and magical items. A mage-thief who specializes in pickpocketing such items could be a relatively low occurance. But enough to be a problem to contend with.

 

I would think the mage could walk around with Illusion spells cast to protect himself from pickpocketing. The measure of protection would vary according to the protective spell cast, and whether the enemy counters with spells of their own.

 

Reflected Image, Mirror Image, and Blur should greatly lower the chance of pickpocketing success. A true class thief, for example, should almost certainly fail in a pickpocket attempt versus a target protected by such spells.

 

A very low level mage-thief pickpocket specializing in magic items (such as might be found in BG1 Tutu or the BG1 part of BGT) could however cast Detect Invisibility and then stand whatever chance of suceeding.

 

A higher level mage-thief could use Detect Illusion, thereby dispelling any of the above spells.

 

As for making oneself invisible to protect against a pickpocket attempt that gets a little more complicated:

 

As I read the manual, Invisibility combined wih the spell Non-Detection would be removed by Detect Illusion. However Invisibilty or Improved Invisibility combined with a Cloak of Non-Detection would still hold up versus Detect Illusion (since not even True Sight works against such a cloak). This would make such cloaks highly valuable, prized items, incidentally.

 

Mislead, Project Image, and Simulacrum would protect against a pickpocket entirely--unless the enemy mage-thief pickpocket casts True Sight. And as mentioned, a Cloak of Non-Detection will not protect against True Sight. So a mage's spellbook (and other magical items) would always be vulnerable to a very high level mage-thief pickpocket.

 

An incapacitated mage (unconscious, panicked, stunned, confused, etc.) could be protected by another mage casting Otiluke's on him. Or perhaps some other spell.

 

Modify Potions of Clarity

 

Another possible defense against pickpocketing is that Potions of Clarity could be modified to protect against pickpocket. This might be the one countermeasure against a mage-thief pickpocket who uses True Sight. I would make these potions extremely expensive and hard to come by.

[jastey]

I can't say whether the spellbook could be turned into an item, maybe a workaround with disableing the BG spellbook if the item is gone or something like that would be possible. It just crossed my mind, that to make it balanced, the other classes should be similar voulnerable (I am not saying I would like this in the game, though): weapons of warriors should be stealable, too, so after a heavy fight with some confusion etc. if the enemy got away the good sword would be gone.

[Jarno Mikkola]

In the case of Irenicus dungeon, I would make it so that the spellbook has been destroyed, i.e., it is irretrievable. The mage then has to start over with a brand new, blank spellbook available at Sorcerous Sundries (for a pretty penny).

Ouh that line again, now I declare you as Insane.

 

As I already said here, this should be doable, but I won't be putting my time into this cause I am not that good that I could use the needed spell-macro patchers just to read the spells to update the script that the creature is running...

[Lemernis]

In the case of Irenicus dungeon, I would make it so that the spellbook has been destroyed, i.e., it is irretrievable. The mage then has to start over with a brand new, blank spellbook available at Sorcerous Sundries (for a pretty penny).

Ouh that line again, now I declare you as Insane.

 

Lol, okay, well senile maybe. I meant Adventurer's Mart.

[Lemernis]

So as I imagine playing such a mod... I'm not if it would be more fun strategically... or if it would just end up being annoying to have to protect the spellbook.

 

On the one hand, it adds a rather nice random variable. It should definitely add a huge wild card to the game.

 

On the other hand, taking precautions against a mage being pickpocketed every time you're in a big city or tavern could get to be a pain. Or during the game's many hundreds of battles to have to deal with the everpresent possibility that an enemy thief can make away with a party mage's spellbook if the mage is incapacitated. And then having to go to a spell store, buy the blank spellbook and scrolls, and relearn. Or to go a quicker route by obtaining a NPC's spellbook via stealing it or killing them. (Of course then it's always a gamble whether their spell selection will be agreeble to you. And rep loss will result from a failed pickpocket or burglary, or killing a non-hostile NPC mage in the sight of other non-hostile NPCs.)

 

But the upsides are potentially pretty cool. For one thing, you can get your hands on someone else's spellbook. Most of the time maybe a not-so-good one. Occasionally maybe a half-way decent one. But sometimes maybe a really awesome one.

 

If enemy mages drop their spellbooks when they're killed, you could assemble quite a collection of them. Or if you manage to steal them also, either via burglary or pickpocketing. So you might always have several backup spellbooks handy. But then if you gather a whole lot of them, having one occassionally stolen is rendered meaningless.

 

In order to avoid accumulating too many spellbooks, perhaps the Cowled wizards periodically appear and demand that you hand all but one over to them.

 

The success of a gameplay experience like this would depend on how high the incidence would be of losing the spellbook. If it happens too often it would be annoying. If it almost never happens there woudn't be much point to going to all the trouble. The sweet spot would have to be found for how often the risk of losing a spellbook takes place, how ofen loss of a spellbook succeeds (eg, either by pickpocket or in battle when a mage is incapaciated), and how many backup spellbooks a character is likely to be holding onto at any given time.

 

And note that this mod would make sorcerers a very desirable class.

[Jarno Mikkola]

In order to avoid accumulating too many spellbooks, perhaps the Cowled wizards periodically appear and demand that you hand all but one over to them.

How would they determine which book to take?

And that's just another good reason to kill all the Cowled &/%¤# wizards, right? After all, they do stop coming, eventually.

[Lemernis]

In order to avoid accumulating too many spellbooks, perhaps the Cowled wizards periodically appear and demand that you hand all but one over to them.

How would they determine which book to take?

And that's just another good reason to kill all the Cowled &/%¤# wizards, right? After all, they do stop coming, eventually.

 

Hmm...

 

Is it possible for each mage in the party, the Cowls demand that all but one spellbook be surrendered?

 

Of course the party then either agrees or enjoins the Cowls in a fight. (Especially if they are David Wallace's Cowled Wizards I would think the latter woud be the wrong move.)

 

Maybe each mage could be allowed to drop one on the ground and all other spell books are removed from the inventory?

 

Or would that be too complicated?

 

***

 

Edit: Actually, come to think of it, there's no reason mages in the party can't all share a single spellbook, if there's no other choice. They'd probably hate it, of course. But at memorization time the book could be passed around.

 

Maybe the Cowls could periodically randomly remove all but one spellbook from the entire party? I.e., script searches among the party's entire inventory and randomly removes each in succession until only one remains, and leaves that one?

[Lemernis]

Re: an enemy pickpocketing an incapaciated mage in your party during a battle:

 

Would the easiest way to do this be just to use a script for incapacitated mages that simply removes all spellbooks from their inventory according to a random chance? Probably best to keep that simple, right? I.e., regardless of the type of impairment, I mean. An unconscious, stunned, or paralyzed target would be very easy to steal the book from. Where a panicked (and hasted) or Confused mage would present more of a challenge. But taking that sort of variable into account would get too complicated I'm sure.

[plainab]

Re: an enemy pickpocketing an incapaciated mage in your party during a battle:

 

Would the easiest way to do this be just to use a script for incapacitated mages that simply removes all spellbooks from their inventory according to a random chance? Probably best to keep that simple, right? I.e., regardless of the type of impairment, I mean. An unconscious, stunned, or paralyzed target would be very easy to steal the book from. Where a panicked (and hasted) or Confused mage would present more of a challenge. But taking that sort of variable into account would get too complicated I'm sure.

Talking BG2 engine right?

 

I haven't given this a shot, but it might be doable as far as picking the pockets and stuff like that but I don't know about disabling the actual use of the spell book. This would get used in dplayer3 and require that party ai be on.

IF
Range(Player1,0) //I am player one -- make 5 more like this one for each party member
OR(2) //one of the following two
Class(Myself,MAGE_ALL) //I am mage
Class(Myself,BARD) //I am bard
See([ENEMY]) //I see enemy
Class(LastSeenBy(Myself),THIEF_ALL)) //Enemy is a thief
Range(LastSeenBy(Myself),10) //is near me
HPPercentGT(LastSeenBy(Myself),50) //isn't too bad off - they wouldn't steal something if they're dying
StateCheck(Myself,STATE_MAGE_HELPLESS) //make a combo of states like STATE_REALLY_DEAD that gets what you want to look for
HasItem("spellbook",Myself) //I have spell book
THEN
//split the responses in half
RESPONSE #50 //response 1
GiveItem("spellbook",LastSeenBy(Myself)) //give them my spell book cause it's the same as if they had taken it
RESPONSE #50 //response 2
ActionOverride(LastSeenBy(Myself),PickPockets(Player1)) //have them pick my pockets for a random item
END

 

Maybe instead of your personal spell book getting taken, you can pick up the spell books of fallen mages. They could be designed to allow access to a random spell once per day or some other amount of time. You could then use it like a scroll or write it into your own spell book. It would be these spell books that the thieves and cowled wizards would actually be after.