Thief skill items; a complete overview [BG1]

[Dakk]

For no particular reason I decided to look up all items in the game that affect Thief skills, with Item Revision installed. As Rogue Rebalancing also adds a healthy dose of these items - and is a premium mod that plays well with IR - I included them in this list too. I also threw in the one item in BG1UB that qualifies (it brings a BG2 item into BG1, that IR then changes).

 

Item list

All items in BG1 with any effect on Thief skills, in no special order:

                	HiS	MS	Locks	Pickp	FindT	SetT	DI	DEX
Shadow Armor    	10							
Night's Embrace  	40							
Boots of Stealth		40						
Gloves of the Rogue¤			15	15		15		
Masterbelt*			10		10			10
Cowl of Acuity*					15			
Deep Red Ioun Stone*	(2-5)	(2-5)	(5)	(5)	(5)	(5)		1
Gauntlets of DEX	(5-8)	(5-8)	(10)	(10)	(10)	(10)		2
Karajah's Armor  	(5-8)	(5-8)	(10)	(10)	(10)	(10)		2
Potion of M. Thievery	20	20	20	20				
Potion of Perception					20	20		
Legend:
*    = only with Rogue Rebalancing (store)
¤    = only with BG1UB (drop)
(x)  = skill points from Dexterity increase 

Most of the data should be self explanatory, but for the sake of clarity: (from left to right) Hide in Shadows, Move Silently, Open Locks, Pick Pockets, Find Traps, Set Traps, Detect Illusion and Dexterity bonus. The values in parenthesis are the added thieving skills for increased DEX. The DEX bonus only apply for DEX 17 and higher, but if you have lower DEX you're not much of a thief anyway. Something quirky and not widely known is that HiS and MS increase irregularly while other thief skills increase linearly (and DI does not increase at all from DEX).

NB. In RR the potions above are quite more powerful, the posted values are for IR.

 

When are they found

I've sorted the above items after when they are possible to acquire in game - early, mid, late. In broad strokes early is up to the bandit camp, late is after reaching Baldur's Gate and ToTSC content, with mid in between. Also added how how difficult the item is to get - easy, medium or hard. It's a somewhat arbitrary scale, with emphasis on price (if in store) and difficulty of opponent (if drop).

• EARLY: Shadow Armor (medium/hard), Night's Embrace-2 (easy), Boots of Stealth-1 (easy), Masterbelt (easy), Deep Red Ioun Stone (medium), Gauntlets of Dexterity (easy), Potion(s) of Perception-1 (easy)
• MID: Boots of Stealth-2 (easy)
• LATE: Night's Embrace-2 (easy), Gloves of the Rogue (easy/medium), Cowl of Acuity (medium), Karajah's Armor (hard), Potion(s) of Master Thievery-1 & 2 (easy), Potion(s) of Perception-2 (easy)

Observations

- The across the board skill points increase from DEX is pretty good. Especially if you pile it on, for say +3 DEX. Gauntlets of Dexterity is very good in (on?) the hands of a thief.

- With IR only, and not counting potions, there's no equipment that increases Open Locks, Pick Pockets, Find Traps, Set Traps or Detect Illusion! Even counting potions, Set Traps has no bonus.

- The Boots of Stealth are extremely powerful and important, but the first pair is part of a fetch-quest and you lose them in return for a measly 300 XP and 100 gold. I believe many players choose never to complete that quest.

- Find Traps is hard to boost.

- Detect Illusion is a very powerful skill in BG1, but very hard to get any use of unless you pour levels into it.

- The most important items are possible to acquire quite early.

 

Between IR and RR (and to a degree also BG1UB, as the Gloves of the Rogue are so powerful) the selection is pretty ok. With only IR the BG1 assortment is quite anemic, with only three (3) items, not counting potions and DEX increasing items. Also note that Karajah's armor is very late game. In BG2 you get basically all of the above and then there's stuff like Cloak of Elvenkind, Boots of Elvenkind, Ring of the Phantom Wraith, Ring of the Burglar and much more.

 

Should there be more items that give Thief skill points in BG1? Can and should IR change or add anything?

 

Cheers

[Dakk]

Completed first post, and reserved this one.

[Grammarsalad]

For no particular reason I decided to look up all items in the game that affect Thief skills, with Item Revision installed. As Rogue Rebalancing also adds a healthy dose of these items - and is a premium mod that plays well with IR - I included them in this list too. I also threw in the one item in BG1UB that qualifies (it brings a BG2 item into BG1, that IR then changes).

 

Item list

All items in BG1 with any effect on Thief skills, in no special order:

 

HiS	MS	Locks	Pickp	FindT	SetT	DI	DEXShadow Armor    	10							Night's Embrace  	40							Boots of Stealth		40						Gloves of the Rogue¤			15	15		15		Masterbelt*			10		10			10Cowl of Acuity*					15			Deep Red Ioun Stone*	(2-5)	(2-5)	(5)	(5)	(5)	(5)		1Gauntlets of DEX	(5-8)	(5-8)	(10)	(10)	(10)	(10)		2Karajah's Armor  	(5-8)	(5-8)	(10)	(10)	(10)	(10)		2Potion of M. Thievery	20	20	20	20				Potion of Perception					20	20		Legend:*    = only with Rogue Rebalancing (store)¤    = only with BG1UB (drop)(x)  = skill points from Dexterity increase

Most of the data should be self explanatory, but for the sake of clarity: (from left to right) Hide in Shadows, Move Silently, Open Locks, Pick Pockets, Find Traps, Set Traps, Detect Illusion and Dexterity bonus. The values in parenthesis are the added thieving skills for increased DEX. The DEX bonus only apply for DEX 17 and higher, but if you have lower DEX you're not much of a thief anyway. Something quirky and not widely known is that HiS and MS increase irregularly while other thief skills increase linearly (and DI does not increase at all from DEX).

NB. In RR the potions above are quite more powerful, the posted values are for IR.

 

When are they found

I've sorted the above items after when they are possible to acquire in game - early, mid, late. In broad strokes early is up to the bandit camp, late is after reaching Baldur's Gate and ToTSC content, with mid in between. Also added how how difficult the item is to get - easy, medium or hard. It's a somewhat arbitrary scale, with emphasis on price (if in store) and difficulty of opponent (if drop).

• EARLY: Shadow Armor (medium/hard), Night's Embrace-2 (easy), Boots of Stealth-1 (easy), Masterbelt (easy), Deep Red Ioun Stone (medium), Gauntlets of Dexterity (easy), Potion(s) of Perception-1 (easy)
• MID: Boots of Stealth-2 (easy)
• LATE: Night's Embrace-2 (easy), Gloves of the Rogue (easy/medium), Cowl of Acuity (medium), Karajah's Armor (hard), Potion(s) of Master Thievery-1 & 2 (easy), Potion(s) of Perception-2 (easy)

Observations

- The across the board skill points increase from DEX is pretty good. Especially if you pile it on, for say +3 DEX. Gauntlets of Dexterity is very good in (on?) the hands of a thief.

- With IR only, and not counting potions, there's no equipment that increases Open Locks, Pick Pockets, Find Traps, Set Traps or Detect Illusion! Even counting potions, Set Traps has no bonus.

- The Boots of Stealth are extremely powerful and important, but the first pair is part of a fetch-quest and you lose them in return for a measly 300 XP and 100 gold. I believe many players choose never to complete that quest.

- Find Traps is hard to boost.

- Detect Illusion is a very powerful skill in BG1, but very hard to get any use of unless you pour levels into it.

- The most important items are possible to acquire quite early.

 

Between IR and RR (and to a degree also BG1UB, as the Gloves of the Rogue are so powerful) the selection is pretty ok. With only IR the BG1 assortment is quite anemic, with only three (3) items, not counting potions and DEX increasing items. Also note that Karajah's armor is very late game. In BG2 you get basically all of the above and then there's stuff like Cloak of Elvenkind, Boots of Elvenkind, Ring of the Phantom Wraith, Ring of the Burglar and much more.

 

Should there be more items that give Thief skill points in BG1? Can and should IR change or add anything?

 

Cheers

I think "yes" to both questions, though I don't think large bonuses a are needed. I would also hope for less magical items to fill as many gaps as possible. Not only would such be a nice companion with the masterwork component, it is also "realistic". IRL thief types use all sorts of items to help them do the deed. Masterwork lock picks and "thieves tools" (for disabling traps) seem reasonable. Padded boots could give a small bonus to MS, and camo padded armor could increase HS (say +5% each).

[Dakk]

 

Should there be more items that give Thief skill points in BG1? Can and should IR change or add anything?

I think "yes" to both questions, though I don't think large bonuses a are needed. I would also hope for less magical items to fill as many gaps as possible. Not only would such be a nice companion with the masterwork component, it is also "realistic". IRL thief types use all sorts of items to help them do the deed. Masterwork lock picks and "thieves tools" (for disabling traps) seem reasonable. Padded boots could give a small bonus to MS, and camo padded armor could increase HS (say +5% each).

 

 

I'm of the same opinion. The current crop of thieving skill-affecting items are not sufficient. I very much like the idea of non-magical items, in the vein of masterwork weapons.

[Demivrgvs]

Sorry man for not giving my opinion yet, I have very little free time or at least not enough to write my (in)famous walls of text for this kinda of stuff. Right now when I have some spare time I focus on quick fixes and tweaks for IR and SR (especially the latter lately) based on beta testers reports.

 

As soon as the next builds are ready (should be within this week) and I have some serious time to dedicate to this matter I'll be back here.

[Jarno Mikkola]

Toolkit belt... costs 100gb in Berecost.
Extended Toolkit belt,
Enhanced Toolkit belt, adventures mart stuff ... ~3000gb.
Extensively enhanced toolkit belt.

The belts buckle has a goblin head as a signature of the burglars purpose, when the belt is correctly tied, a goblin voice says: "don't get caught with me on !" There's a loose button next the head, it's promised that the belt will disappears when you push the button.
This belt is genuine goblin tech.

Although it's never said, it might be implied that as the belt disappears, it's likely that the tools either it will drop down causing a lot of noise, or that you won't ever see the belt nor the tools ever again.

 

[Dakk]

Sorry man for not giving my opinion yet, I have very little free time or at least not enough to write my (in)famous walls of text for this kinda of stuff. Right now when I have some spare time I focus on quick fixes and tweaks for IR and SR (especially the latter lately) based on beta testers reports.

 

As soon as the next builds are ready (should be within this week) and I have some serious time to dedicate to this matter I'll be back here.

You know I'm a huge fan of your Wall-of-Texts™!

 

Keep tinkering on SR, and we'll get IR nice and finished when that's done.

[Demivrgvs]

Actually I was working on IR yesterday, but I keep jumping from one beta to the other depending on beta testers reports and/or feedback. You cannot imagine how long is my to-do list man!

 

Anyway, short answer: this matter is not a priority and the next IR build is already pretty big in terms of changes, but as I said in my previous post I will be back here soon.

[Istfemer]

Toolkit belt... costs 100gb in Berecost.

Extended Toolkit belt,

Enhanced Toolkit belt, adventures mart stuff ... ~3000gb.

Extensively enhanced toolkit belt.

 

The belts buckle has a goblin head as a signature of the burglars purpose, when the belt is correctly tied, a goblin voice says: "don't get caught with me on !" There's a loose button next the head, it's promised that the belt will disappears when you push the button.

This belt is genuine goblin tech.

Although it's never said, it might be implied that as the belt disappears, it's likely that the tools either it will drop down causing a lot of noise, or that you won't ever see the belt nor the tools ever again.

 

 

I like this suggestion!

 

- Conventional Toolkit belt

- Expanded Toolkit belt

- Extended Toolkit belt

 

Just like the different DOS memory types --- easy to memorize.