Unearthed Arcana presents Scales of Balance: a post-hac tweak pack

[Nameless_Knight]

3 questions:

1) Is component 'Weapon Proficiency Overhaul (WPO): Overall Overhaul' compatible with the first subcomponent of the "Revised Proficiencies" options in Tweaks Anthology? The WPO: Expanded Combat Skills System is compatible, but the Weapon Proficiency Overhaul just says it is 'generally not compatible with stuff like the weapon proficiency changes in Tweaks Anthology'. Could you clarify for this specific subcomponent? (the subcomponent that merges maces/morningstars)

2) Is the Hit Dice Overhaul (HDO): Revised Hit Point Progression compatible with The Tweaks Anthology - Allow HP Rolls Through Level 20 [Angel]? If it is, in what install order?

3) I see no mention of grandmastery anywhere in the readme. Does this mean that mastery or high mastery is the highest attainable weapon proficiency in Scales of Balance? And that therefore I have no need to install things like GM (Baldurdash) etc?
 

Edited October 3, 2023 by Nameless_Knight

[subtledoctor]

1) Yes, that CDTweaks component should be installed first to combine morning stars and maces; then this mod will combine them with clubs as well. (Be aware, however, that adding Item Revisions “Weapon Changes” and Faiths & Powers revised priest item use in addition to CDTweaks and SoB can cause hiccups.)

2) IF that CDTweaks component is compatible, then it should be installed after this mod. (I’m not sure whether they actually are compatible.)

3) This proficiency overhaul moves the GM bonuses (sort of) down to high mastery. So fighters can attain the highest rank with fewer proficiency points, and spend more points on other weapons. So it is better for fighters, and it is not compatible with other mods that are related to grandmastery. 

[jmerry]

The CDTweaks component edits the hp**** tables in place; it reads whatever's in the row for level 9 and copies it to levels 10-20.

The Scates of Balance component overwrites the whole table.

So, the interaction. If you install the Scales of Balance component second, it wins and overwrites everything the CDTweaks component did. If you install the CDTweaks component second, it propagates the level 9 behavior to level 20. Does that mean you're rolling hit dice for all those levels? It depends. The first two options ("Generous", "Closer to average") don't roll hit dice at level 9, so the combination is not compatible and the CDTweaks component does nothing. The third option ("Reduced") does roll hit dice at level 9, so the combination in that case is compatible and you get your smaller hit dice all the way to level 20.

[Nameless_Knight]

@subtledoctor@jmerry

Thank you both for the clarifications. Appreciated.

Edited October 3, 2023 by Nameless_Knight

[subtledoctor]

Yeah, the first two options here only give you hit points through level 7 or 8. In this concept, advancing in level is supposed to make you tougher than a non-adventurer, but not orders of magnitude tougher. So it only gives you a few hit dice before petering out to de minimis bonuses. (Honestly, I have half a mind to drop that down to only 5 or 6 levels of hit dice...)

Honestly, those two options are all about reducing your overall number of hit points in the late game and make thigns tougher for you. They are not really conceptually consistent with another mod that increases your hit points. The third option might be consistent, in that it is supposed to give you something like average HP rolls - so, how you apply those rolls is up to you. I still don't approve of all this HP inflation though    

Edited October 3, 2023 by subtledoctor

[Nameless_Knight]

3 hours ago, subtledoctor said:

Yeah, the first two options here only give you hit points through level 7 or 8. In this concept, advancing in level is supposed to make you tougher than a non-adventurer, but not orders of magnitude tougher. So it only gives you a few hit dice before petering out to de minimis bonuses. (Honestly, I have half a mind to drop that down to only 5 or 6 levels of hit dice...)

Honestly, those two options are all about reducing your overall number of hit points in the late game and make thigns tougher for you. They are not really conceptually consistent with another mod that increases your hit points. The third option might be consistent, in that it is supposed to give you something like average HP rolls - so, how you apply those rolls is up to you. I still don't approve of all this HP inflation though    

My main draw to this component was the idea that the 'generous' option would allow me to retain hit dice rolls whilst preventing certain classes from outpacing others' hp in unusual ways (something pointed out in the readme). I was hoping that it wouldn't make things tougher; only that it will breath some life into the hit dice mechanic and increase its usability for modded SCS/ascension runs.

Edited October 3, 2023 by Nameless_Knight

[Morgoth]

Can't find the thread of the newer version of this mod anywhere - would you kindly link it in the starting post + write a last post here with the link (and then ask the mods to close it?)

Edit: I found a way on how to find it - I think I have the newer version on my disk - will find the name and then search for the topic on google

Edit 2: Here it is: 

 

Edited January 29 by Morgoth

[subtledoctor]

16 minutes ago, Morgoth said:

would you kindly link it in the starting post + write a last post here with the link (and then ask the mods to close it?)

Good idea. I edited the first post in this thread to point to the new mods. To bookend things, the relevant information is:

Scales of Balance is deprecated again. Forever this time.

For my tweaks related to weapons, armor, and other items, now you should use SubtleD’s Item Tweaks.

For my revisions to the weapon proficiency system, and a feat system tied into proficiency points, now you should use Combat Skills & Proficiencies. 

For my tweaks related to ability scores, hit dice, XP, etc. now you should use SubtleD’s Stat Overhauls.

Those three mods should be installed in that order. Generally, Item Tweaks goes after kits but before SCS; Combat Skills and Stat Overhauls go after SCS.

If a moderator could close this thread, that would be great. 

[GawainBS]

Is there a subsite or something dedicated to your mods, @subtledoctor? Honestly, I can't play without them, but if you come back to the game after a couple of months, it can be tricky to find out what's what no in the subtle-verse.

[subtledoctor]

1 hour ago, GawainBS said:

Is there a subsite or something dedicated to your mods, @subtledoctor? Honestly, I can't play without them, but if you come back to the game after a couple of months, it can be tricky to find out what's what no in the subtle-verse.

My signature! …is basically the only place. Which I am realizing is a problem.

Annoyingly, the mods are split between two different Github accounts, so I couldn’t even point to Github. And both Github accounts include a bunch of small/test/garbage repos. 

There was some talk a while ago of setting up a subforum here for all of the Unearthed Arcana mods, but that petered out and never happened. (Maybe because of the poor state of the Readmes… I’ve been noodling around with the Readmes and Tome & Blood is in decent shape… but man, FnP is such a huge beast of a mod, trying to write up the descriptions for all the kits, adapting them to html… it’s brutally slow and annoying.)

I suppose SHS would host them, but that place is down half the time… AFAIC G3 is the place to be for BG modding. 

[GawainBS]

Ok, your signature is indeed a good tip.

A general readme, i.e. install order would be cool too. You repeat it often enough, but for someone new to the mods, it's not always clear.

[subtledoctor]

Heh, maybe I should put them in install order in my sig, instead of categorized!

[GawainBS]

Actually, quite a good idea.