IWD2 NPCs now compatible with IWD2EE project.

[bearcattony00]

The Red Chimera group did fix the game crashing script bug a couple days ago.  Google up IWD2EE and you will see their forum.  They are doing a good job.  They are trying to help Beamdog facelift IWD2.  As many of you know, there is a great known mystery that Beamdog can't find the script and codes to do IWD2EE since it is so different from the other infinity engine games.  It is in Beta testing so you have to drop an email to the RedChimera authors directly and wait for their response.  You need to setup a Github account as well.

[WhoIsDaniel]

This is great!  I am just installing IWD2EE and after playing through IWDEE1 and using the  Icewind Dale NPCs MOD I found your mod here and am really pumped that IWD2 NPCs now compatible with IWD2EE project.  This will be great.

Oh, I almost forgot; should this be installed before or after the IWD2EE project mod?

Edited July 2, 2023 by WhoIsDaniel

[paladin84]

Now, after IWD2EE is released and they have bunch of joinable NPCs is it possible to redo this mod (or create another small one) the way that you don't have to create the whole party at the begnning and can join NPC from the mod as other joinable NPCs (obviously for IWD2EE only)? They can be located at, say, Wicked Wench, and you can hire/fire them freely before leaving Targos.

[CamDawg]

I'd love for this to be more properly integrated, now that IWD2EE allows it.

While the technical side wouldn't be a problem, unfortunately this would require a fair bit of writing--at a minimum join/rejoin/kick dialogues. With @Domi gone I don't see it happening any time soon.

At any rate if you're watching the Github, I'm slowly working on IWD2EE integration and should have a testing version soon-ish.

[paladin84]

1 hour ago, CamDawg said:

At any rate if you're watching the Github, I'm slowly working on IWD2EE integration and should have a testing version soon-ish.

Sounds great! I will be looking forward for the new version of the mod. I really want to play IWD2EE + IWD2NPC together and if a new version is coming, I'd rather wait.

1 hour ago, CamDawg said:

While the technical side wouldn't be a problem, unfortunately this would require a fair bit of writing--at a minimum join/rejoin/kick dialogues. With @Domi gone I don't see it happening any time soon.

So, without her permission, it is not possible to add any dialogs, even as trivial as: Do you really want me to leave?/Ok, I will wait for you here./I am happy to travel with you again.

Is it possible to make another mod for that? I don't want to violate anyone's rights I just don't fully understand how it all works: what exactly you can change in the mod and what you cannot.

[Thacobell]

Its a permissions thing. Its considered rude and disrespctful to alter a modder's work without them giving the go-ahead.

[paladin84]

3 hours ago, Thacobell said:

Its a permissions thing. Its considered rude and disrespctful to alter a modder's work without them giving the go-ahead.

I see, but for me such text additions look like bug fixing, or rather mod adaption for a new main game version... and it is especially sad, considering that the author is disappeared. Ok, if it not possible, it is not possible...

[Thacobell]

Well, its new content. Its not just adapting the mod to make it run, its a whole new character writing. Even if its minor.

[scheele]

12 hours ago, Thacobell said:

Well, its new content. Its not just adapting the mod to make it run, its a whole new character writing. Even if its minor.

I wouldn't like it either if my mod was changed without my permission. But, given the circumstances, this point of yours gives off too much of a purist vibe. IMHO this is nothing more than a technical correction that does not require the author's permission.

[CamDawg]

I'd like to expand on this a bit.

G3's always tried to be a place where we put modders first. To that end we try to provide tools to make their lives easier, eliminate or streamline the boring and routine tasks, and generally try to get out of their way. While we've often missed the mark, I think the longevity of the site shows we've done fairly well overall. This also means when modders want to move on from IE modding that we do our best to keep their mods in good shape while respecting their work. In practical terms it means we try to fix bugs that pop up, as time allows, while continuing to showcase the author's work in the best light we can. This is something we take seriously, and yes, this matters. 

Even if we were to theoretically set that aside, this is Domi's baby: 18k lines of dialogue takes serious passion and commitment. Just writing the dialogues takes a high level of familiarity with the NPCs to do them justice. Then there's the whole other thing of where the NPCs get placed, does it make sense for them to stick around if kicked, and even NPC-specific issues like whether Nord and Hildury should come as a pair, etc. That's an exceptionally hard ask for anyone who's not as connected to these characters as Domi. Yeah, we could do something crappy and give them some generic join dialogues. However, that crappy join dialogue now becomes your introduction to the character, and that would undermine so much of Domi's work.

[paladin84]

Ok, I see the point. I still feel that without additional replicas this mod would feel incomplete if it is played with IWD2EE. Eg, if you fill the party with the characters from IWD2NPC from the begiining, you can kick IWD2NPC characters when new IWD2EE NPCs joined the group and they would leave without a word. However, if such approach is for greater good of the modders community, I cannot argue with it.

Another question: is there a way to find Domi and ask for her permission?

[Guest Guest that tells the truth]

But making an addon and making it explicit it wasn't made by the original author surely wouldn t harm you or g3. I guess you are in that position where you, being the admin cant be put in position to do it, but other users could.  

 

[Thacobell]

3 hours ago, scheele said:

I wouldn't like it either if my mod was changed without my permission. But, given the circumstances, this point of yours gives off too much of a purist vibe. IMHO this is nothing more than a technical correction that does not require the author's permission.

There's nothing "purist" about not altering an author's work without permission. Writing new dialogue is not a bug fix. The mod is not broken because it lacks this interaction.

[paladin84]

6 hours ago, Guest Guest that tells the truth said:

But making an addon and making it explicit it wasn't made by the original author surely wouldn t harm you or g3. I guess you are in that position where you, being the admin cant be put in position to do it, but other users could.  

About this, I found in the mod readme (https://gibberlings3.github.io/Documentation/readmes/readme-iwd2npc.html) this text:

Quote

Mods which extend material presented here (new NPCs for IWD2 who banter with IWD2 NPCs, or romance for one of the IWD2 NPCs) are welcome as separate modifications, with the appropriate credit given to the authors. If you want something to become a direct part of this mod, you will need to contact G3. 

Does it mean that I can create the dedicated mod "IWD2NPC proper joining/removing for IWD2EE" (with the propert respect to Domi as the author of IWD2NPC) that can be installed after IWD2NPC and IWD2EE without any copyright issues and with the permission from the current mod maintainers?

[lynx]

Of course, you're just modding a mod, not touching the state of the original mod.