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Red Wizards are tough!


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Yikes, those Thayans in AR3000 are deadly. My party didn't really have an effective counter for their Confusion spell. Gavin doesn't have Chaotic Commands yet. And I don't have access to the Greenstone Amulet yet. (It's a BGT game in chapter 3, and for some reason map AR 0400 isn't accessable from the north side of AR0900--so I can't get to Ulgoth's Beard. In fact come to think of it, none of the ToSC maps are available.)


I was having too hard a time taking them in a fair fight. So I ended up resorting to metagaming by casting Silence before any of them was in perception range; then casting Stinking Cloud and rapidly fireballing away with a wand. Total cheese. (Perhaps one could say that a scout would be able to overhear them on the dais chanting evil incantations? But still.)


I guess I could also have cast Animate Dead instead of fireballing. But I figured SCS mages would be more likely to ignore the relatively low level immediate threat of some skellies and seek out the party.


Even after being silenced, they cast Vocalize and proceed business as usual. But being initially Silenced buys enough time to hurt them bad enough that they're then on the defensive, playing catch-up (eg, gulping healing potions) against the fireballs.


For future reference, what (legitimate) strategies have you all found effective against these four Thayan mages?

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It's a BGT game in chapter 3, and for some reason map AR 0400 isn't accessable from the north side of AR0900--so I can't get to Ulgoth's Beard. In fact come to think of it, none of the ToSC maps are available.

In BGT you can play the TotSC content only after chapter 6 (after clearing Cloackwood and unlocking Baldur's Gate).


As for strategy, did you try casting Dispel Magic? Or waiting til you get one or two extra levels?

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Ah, okay, thanks for the info re: BGT and ToSC quest availability. Sounds like what you're describing, though, is the start of chapter 5, right? (I.e., killing Davaeorn ends chapter 4. And as far as I know, after that you have access to BG city... Actually, I don't know if flooding the mines is required to gain access to Baldur's Gate... I've always flooded the mine.)


I did not think to try Dispel Magic, that should work. Good suggestion. (I'm used to thinking of Remove Magic from BG2, a spell the party doesn't have at this point.)


In this case party is level 5-7. I guess in the future I could come back and try fighting the Red Wizards after Cloakwood, DSotSC, the Grey Clan, and the ToSC quests.

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Bit cheesy, but chuck a load of summons amongst them then run away. They'll waste all their spells on them. Then move in for the kill.


Also Wands of Paralyzation work effectively on a huge range of enemies in BG1 (unless they are Improved Invisible so you can't target them with it).

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Check my thread about the same topic.


In my current game I play with magic arrows working against PfNM and it makes things slightly easier.


I don't do cheese, but used the following tactics:

Pre-buffs with Chant, Bless and DUHM, in case of battle.

Since Eddie left after killing Dynaheir (I'm True Neutral so I let them settle their differences) there is of course a battle.

Branwen enrages and Shar-Teel quaffs a potion of 50% MR. Then they move in position to block the stairs and attack Denak.

Monty hides in shadows and bides his time.

Jaheira too bides her time.

Kagain, with two stars in Darts, starts pelting Denak with Darts +1, after quaffing a Potion of Heroism.

Helen Beck, my F/M/T casts Resist Fear from a Scroll.

Enemies cast Horror (no effect), Slow (affects only Branwen IIRC), Confusion (Shar-Teel is confused, Branwen is immune and the others retreat to get out of the AoE), and Monster Summoning.


In round two Jaheira Charms one of the monsters and Montaron backstabs another.

Helen Beck turns the tide of the battle by using a Cloud Kill scroll. It instantly kills one of the enemy mages, as well as most of the monsters.

Branwen quaffs a Potion of Free Movement to avoid the effects of an incoming Hold Person.


The battle rages on and thanks to the Cloud Kill and Shar-Teel (even though she is confused) and Branwen holding their ground, preventing the enemy mages from escaping the deadly Cloudkill, which damage them and disrupts their spells every round.

Kagain and Helen Beck, with their +1 Darts and Arrows, then kills off the mages one by one.

It was extremely satisfying to hear that bastard Denak's death cry from the Cloudkill after he quaffed a Potion of Invisibility. :laugh:


I think the only non-cheesy way to beat them (without losing half your party) is to use the Cloudkill scroll or perhaps Monster Summoning/Animate Dead to distract the mages. Since I use Hard Times there's extremely few Monster Summon charges in the game, so I rely on the Cloudkill scroll.

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Get them to Dimension Door out, it is a usable spell for BG1.


AFAIK it's never used as a combat spell (unlike the old Gold Box games) or even a strategic spell; it's always scripted.

It's not even listed in the BG2 manual.

It *would* add another tactical challenge, if *both* PCs and NPCs could cast it in battle.


EDIT: BTW, only Denak is high enough level to cast it anyway, and it would mean one less Confusion spell for him...

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v8 is rather better at having people move out of cloudkills (borrows code from SCSII for this).


I'm using v8, but the Thay Wizards don't have anywhere to run, being stuck on a small platfrom and with my front gals blocking their escape. :laugh:

BTW, looking forward to v9.


Can't count, sorry - I meant v9.

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Just thought I'd add a tiny question here to David:


I'm in the process of launching a multiplayer BGT-run, will it be a problem starting on v8 and upgrading to v9 'on the fly'? :laugh:


Not huge problems, but slightly more than usual - you'll have to completely uninstall v8 before installing v9, which might be a nuisance if v8 is deeply buried in your install order.

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