Maze is killing my characters

[Guest Fanname]

Playing with SR + SCS (EETrilogy mod with only Sirene NPC mod) and maze has begun killing my characters when the effect ends. I play with a party of 6, and with SCS, mages would sometimes cast maze. Normally it's not a problem, they return eventually, but after starting chapter 4, any maze cast would kill my characters on their return. This first happened with Perth in the pirate town. He cast maze on Viconia and Jaheira. After a while, when they return, they die instantly. Log just says Viconia: Death. This didn't happen in previous chapters. I reload, and it happened again, this time my main and Viconia gets maze. When they return, its game over cause my main just dies. Later, at Spellhold when I fight the Lich, it casts maze, and the person that gets caught would die instantly when it returns. What's happening?

[subtledoctor]

Same happens to me - I assumed this was the SR version of Imprisonment, so I never thought it might be a bug. But now I think I'll look more closely at the files...

EDIT - it does seem to be a bug; the Imprisonment spell uses the Pocket Plane visual effect, as noted by @Bartimaeus. Whereas what I saw in my game is specifically the Maze visual effect, followed by the character disappearing, and when the character reappeared he died immediately.

I don't see anything obvious in the spell that suggests why this would happen. The only effects in the spell are:

• Maze (op213)
• Set Spellstate (op328)
• Play Visual Effect (op215)
• Play Visual Effect (op215)

The completely unmodded version of the spell in BG2EE 2.6 uses the same op213 effect parameters, and the same projectile; it only uses a different op215 visual effect. But opcode 215 should not be killing people!

I'm at a bit of a loss, here. But it's a pretty bad bug.

Edited March 23, 2022 by subtledoctor

[Guest Fanname]

51 minutes ago, subtledoctor said:

Same happens to me - I assumed this was the SR version of Imprisonment, so I never thought it might be a bug. But now I think I'll look more closely at the files...

I'm not well versed on the changes between vanilla and SR, but the icon that shows up is the maze icon. If imprisonment was changed to maze for SR and and they use the same icon (previous chapter mages may have used maze and starting at chapter 4, they are using the imprisonment -maze version instead), then this might not be a bug as I have originally thought and might be a SCS issue instead. But the only way to break imprisonment/maze is freedom spell...a 9th level spell which I'm not even close to having (only 7th level spells are known). So I'm sure this might be a SCS imbalanced oversight instead.

[Bartimaeus]

3 hours ago, Guest Fanname said:

I'm not well versed on the changes between vanilla and SR, but the icon that shows up is the maze icon. If imprisonment was changed to maze for SR and and they use the same icon (previous chapter mages may have used maze and starting at chapter 4, they are using the imprisonment -maze version instead), then this might not be a bug as I have originally thought and might be a SCS issue instead. But the only way to break imprisonment/maze is freedom spell...a 9th level spell which I'm not even close to having (only 7th level spells are known). So I'm sure this might be a SCS imbalanced oversight instead.

@subtledoctor Yeah, one has to track does what actual spell resource is being used by enemy spellcasters to figure out what's going on here. I have not experienced this exact problem before, not exactly sure where to look. There are only two abilities/spells called "Maze" in my game, and neither of them are the problem. Are you certain that it is indeed a spell called "Maze" being cast - i.e. does it the combat log actually say the spellcaster cast Maze?

Edited March 23, 2022 by Bartimaeus

[subtledoctor]

For me it was in a chaotic combat and I wasn’t looking too closely when the spell was cast, I only noticed ~10 rounds later when Yeslick reappeared and, although only one combatant remained, instantly died. But I do remember the visual effect, which was the “jail bars closing in” on him before he disappeared. 

It’s possible that that it was really Imprisonment - that SR changed Imprisonment to use the Pocket Plane visual but SCS is using its own custom version which, while it inherited SR’s change to “Maze+Kill,” did not inherit the Pocket Plane visual effect. I guess? I’m not sure how that would happen though. 

[DavidW]

Pretty sure SCS is using WIZARD_IMPRISONMENT, not any bespoke version. So it ought to be inheriting SR changes.

[Bartimaeus]

Ergh, duh - it's almost certainly Soul Trap, aka SPIN788. I always forget about Soul Trap...but I thought SPIN788 was only used by Kangaxx?

Edited March 23, 2022 by Bartimaeus

[subtledoctor]

1 hour ago, Bartimaeus said:

Ergh, duh - it's almost certainly Soul Trap, aka SPIN788. I always forget about Soul Trap...but I thought SPIN788 was only used by Kangaxx?

Well, by demiliches anyway... though the demilich in WK did not use it against me. (I am using SCS’ Spellcasting Demiliches though, so that may be why.) 

In my case the effect was triggered by the spellcasting skeleton in the abandoned temple in the swamp in TOB. I wouldn’t expect that guy to cast Soul Trap (being not a demilich), but I guess it’s possible. He is lich-ish. The OP said it happened against Perth the Adept, which is weirder. 

I’ll check SPIN788 when I get a chance. The only other thing I can think of is that op328 effect for spellstate DO_NOT_CAST_SPELLS_AT_ME... maybe some mods got their spellstate wires crossed, and there is something in baldur.bcs that kills you when it detects you with that state? Or something weird like that...

Edited March 23, 2022 by subtledoctor

[jmerry]

The SCS spellcasting demiliches are missing the script section that uses Trap the Soul, and have been for several versions at least. So yes, that's why you didn't see it.

Edited March 23, 2022 by jmerry

[subtledoctor]

49 minutes ago, jmerry said:

The SCS spellcasting demiliches are missing the script section that uses Trap the Soul, and have been for several versions at least. So yes, that's why you didn't see it.

To be fair, I'm using SCS v33.3 which is fairly old. DW#KANGA.BCS has this:

Spoiler

IF
	!Global("DMWWKangaxxWalks","GLOBAL",1)
THEN
	RESPONSE #100
		SetGlobal("DMWWKangaxxWalks","GLOBAL",1)
		MakeGlobal()
END

IF
	!GlobalTimerNotExpired("castspell","LOCALS")
	!See([PC])
	See([NEUTRAL])
THEN
	RESPONSE #100
		SetGlobalTimer("castspell","LOCALS",ONE_ROUND)
		ForceSpell(LastSeenBy(Myself),DEMILICH_TRAP_SOUL)  // SPIN788.SPL (Demilich Soul Trap)
	RESPONSE #100
		SetGlobalTimer("castspell","LOCALS",ONE_ROUND)
		SpellNoDec(LastSeenBy(Myself),WIZARD_FLAME_ARROW)  // SPWI303.SPL (Flame Arrow)
	RESPONSE #100
		SetGlobalTimer("castspell","LOCALS",ONE_ROUND)
		SpellNoDec(LastSeenBy(Myself),WIZARD_SKULL_TRAP)  // SPWI313.SPL (Skull Trap)
END

Huh, glancing at SPIN788, it uses the Maze visual, sets the same spellstate, and uses a Maze effect with the parameter set to "use duration" and the duration is "delayed/permanent." It uses the Maze visual effect. There is a no-save level drain, but no death effect. So is this coded as just a permanent Maze? Weird.

In my game the ToB "Skeleton Mage" has both Imprisonment (SPWI910) and Maze (SPWI813) memorized. Neither the .CRE nor its script has any reference to SPIN788. Given that my version of SPWI910 has the Pocket Plane visual , I am inclined to think that he cast Maze at me. So there is possibly something to do with the Maze opcode, or possibly the SPARKLPU.PRO projectile...? But I think other things probably use that projectile too.

So this is still a mystery to me, at least. I'll see if I have a save file from back then and can maybe re-play the fight. Don't hold your breath, though.

[jmerry]

That "KangaxxWalks" section is for if you let him out of the tomb - he wanders around killing random bystanders. The part of the script that's missing (and should go in his mage script, along with the Watcher's Keep demilich) is the part for using SPIN788 in normal combat with the party.

Spellcasting demiliches may well be a downgrade overall; they lose their blanket high-level spell immunity and their signature attack, so they're only a little different from regular liches in combat.

[Shin]

11 minutes ago, subtledoctor said:

To be fair, I'm using SCS v33.3 which is fairly old. DW#KANGA.BCS has this:

  Reveal hidden contents

 

 

IF
	!Global("DMWWKangaxxWalks","GLOBAL",1)
THEN
	RESPONSE #100
		SetGlobal("DMWWKangaxxWalks","GLOBAL",1)
		MakeGlobal()
END

IF
	!GlobalTimerNotExpired("castspell","LOCALS")
	!See([PC])
	See([NEUTRAL])
THEN
	RESPONSE #100
		SetGlobalTimer("castspell","LOCALS",ONE_ROUND)
		ForceSpell(LastSeenBy(Myself),DEMILICH_TRAP_SOUL)  // SPIN788.SPL (Demilich Soul Trap)
	RESPONSE #100
		SetGlobalTimer("castspell","LOCALS",ONE_ROUND)
		SpellNoDec(LastSeenBy(Myself),WIZARD_FLAME_ARROW)  // SPWI303.SPL (Flame Arrow)
	RESPONSE #100
		SetGlobalTimer("castspell","LOCALS",ONE_ROUND)
		SpellNoDec(LastSeenBy(Myself),WIZARD_SKULL_TRAP)  // SPWI313.SPL (Skull Trap)
END

Huh, glancing at SPIN788, it uses the Maze visual, sets the same spellstate, and uses a Maze effect with the parameter set to "use duration" and the duration is "delayed/permanent." It uses the Maze visual effect. There is a no-save level drain, but no death effect. So is this coded as just a permanent Maze? Weird.

I thought this was brought in at some point to have the end result work much like imprisonment in practice but prevent certain consequences of the actual imprisonment effect, like the game ending if Charname gets imprisoned, or NPCs just disappearing. Maze is more forgiving.

[jmerry]

Yes, that's the obvious intent. The same idea is used at one point in non-mod content: the demiliches in Black Pits 2 have an "Imprisonment" that's actually a 24-hour Maze which also removes Chaotic Commands so as to bypass that protection.

[temnix]

I was told recently that a spell I made was causing characters to die. It does use the Maze effect. And it worked in the fight with the "amazons" in chapter - what would it be, 2, in Baldur's Gate? But later, I don't know how much later, the casting character started dying. If this is related to chapter count or game time count, and if it doesn't only happen to party members, then my phase spiders are also going to start dying when they are encountered later on. Crap. I've done all of the testing in a saved game in Prologue. Well, it's good that somebody mentioned this. Maze is strange in a lot of ways. It interrupts current effects on the character, for instance, like changed colors. They only come back a second or two after reappearing. And if the character had a Maximum hit points bonus on (While Equipped from a ring in my case, if I'm not mistaken), then he comes back first without the bonus. It catches up then, but without the current hp, so the character ends up wounded.

I may have to look into disabling the character instead.

[subtledoctor]

5 minutes ago, temnix said:

And if the character had a Maximum hit points bonus on (While Equipped from a ring in my case, if I'm not mistaken), then he comes back first without the bonus. It catches up then, but without the current hp, so the character ends up wounded.

Huh. This is a possibility. I think Yeslick was wearing a +hp helm in my game; if he was seriously wounded when mazed, than maybe he came back with zero hp without the bonus?

Though it wouldn't explain why Perth the Adept killed Jaheira and Viconia and Charname in the OP's game.

Edited March 23, 2022 by subtledoctor