insolent_worm Posted September 7, 2004 Share Posted September 7, 2004 One of the few BG NPCs that I always felt should have been included in BG2 was Husam (Kivan was another, kudos to Domi for the recent release), the drunk from the Baldur's Gate Thieves' Guild. Extended interaction with him led him to reveal his identity as an undercover Shadow Thief... bickity BAM, easy and logical transition into the story of BG2. And he's a neutral evil, pure-class thief, to boot... an instant selling point for the evil parties that have been so sorely lacking in the thievery department ever since day 1. It amazes me that no one else has tried to bring him back yet. It'd be a simple project... it'd have to be, given my utter lack of modding experience... and I think the end result would simply be a non-romanceable NPC with a handful of quests, an unexciting character sheet, and hopefully the ability to blend in seamlessly with Bioware's other characters. It may sound boring compared to the half-troll half-fire elemental demigod and goddess NPCs out there, but I personally WANT an NPC that feels like legitimate game content, and I assume others feel the same... though that's a rant for another time. Just a brainstorm, I suppose. Provided I find the time to do it, would anyone be interested in seeing this made? Link to comment
Galactygon Posted September 7, 2004 Share Posted September 7, 2004 Finish it first, then we'll talk. -Galactygon Link to comment
insolent_worm Posted September 7, 2004 Author Share Posted September 7, 2004 As I said, it's a BRAINSTORM. I'm not making this for my benefit... if there's no interest, it won't be made. It's a simple question, and I'd appreciate a real answer. Link to comment
Galactygon Posted September 8, 2004 Share Posted September 8, 2004 That doesn't sound like the spirit of a true modder. You make a mod regardless of whether you like it or not, and public opinion is secondary. -Galactygon Link to comment
Idobek Posted September 8, 2004 Share Posted September 8, 2004 Play nice please, Galactygon. Link to comment
Galactygon Posted September 8, 2004 Share Posted September 8, 2004 Fine, I take that back. Still, fully basing a mod on public demands is not my cup of tea. -Galactygon Link to comment
BigRob Posted September 8, 2004 Share Posted September 8, 2004 The idea of a relatively normal NPC is a good one, but you will need one or two things to spice up a cardboard cut-out thief. On the other hand, Husam's role as an undercover Shadow Thief should give an ample source of interesting stuff to talk about, and he should mesh with the existing plot very nicely. One thing to think about: Is Husam working for the Shadow Thieves, or CHARNAME, or himself? Link to comment
Sir BillyBob Posted September 8, 2004 Share Posted September 8, 2004 Perhaps he is working for all the above? An agent for all sides? Interesting concept if his cover gets blown. What if guilds from other locations are out hunting for him and CHARNAME is collateral damage? Normally I can't stomach AFNPC mods (another f***** NPC) and I don't usually install them because of it (alright Valen always gets installed ). But this one could be entertaining. Go for it Tom Clancy. Please, please don't make this another romance mod. Link to comment
insolent_worm Posted September 8, 2004 Author Share Posted September 8, 2004 You make a mod regardless of whether you like it or not, and public opinion is secondary. You are contradicting yourself. You say to ignore personal opinion, and that public opinion is secondary... what's the motivating factor, then? I disagree that public opinion is secondary, anyway. If that is the case, mod-making is done either to make the game fit one's exact standards of perfection or to force one's ideas on an indifferent community. In the case of the former, it's entirely inefficient; one does not write a novel every time one wants to read a good book. In the case of the latter, it's simply selfish. Modding is not done to publish one's own ideas; you are creating work based on another person's game and intellectual property, so the originality of your ideas is void, anyway. You're not making a game, you're modding it. It's that selfish 'check out my awesome idea' mindset that has pumped out so many poor mods in the past: people get so hyped up on their own ideas that they force their mod to be so 'original' that it surpasses and overshadows the game's other elements. The end result is that the game is butchered. Call me altruistic, but modding should done to enhance the playing experience for the whole of the gaming community, not just for yourself... and so what's the point of even trying if there's no community interest? [/soapbox] Still, fully basing a mod on public demands is not my cup of tea. I don't see how that is even remotely related to the subject at hand. There have been no demands made, and I have established that the ideas at the mod's core are an extension of a character from BG1; there has been no public input as of yet that would influence the mod itself. All I ask for is a simple yea or nay as to whether or not the members here feel such a mod has a place in the overall game. Is Husam working for the Shadow Thieves, or CHARNAME, or himself? Good question, and one to which I've already given some thought. I won't go into massive detail, but rest assured, he'll have reasons for sticking around regardless of where CHARNAME may lead him... basically, he won't be jumping ship if the party sides with Bodhi. Wouldn't make much sense if a party loses an evil NPC for taking the 'evil' path. Please, please don't make this another romance mod. HELL no. BG2 is no console RPG; just because something has two legs doesn't mean it's got an uncontrollable attraction to the main character. Besides, there's so much more to character development than simply romantic entanglement. And I agree on AFNPC mods. Kivan and LR were the first NPC mods I've installed in years for that very reason. I'm thinking I may give Tashia a go, though I'm not keeping my hopes up. As I said, I'm no modder. But I've done some fantasy writing and such for years, so with luck I'll be able to put out a character who is likeable for character development purposes rather than sheer statistical might or weirdness. Link to comment
Idobek Posted September 8, 2004 Share Posted September 8, 2004 Please, please don't make this another romance mod. HELL no. BG2 is no console RPG; just because something has two legs doesn't mean it's got an uncontrollable attraction to the main character. Besides, there's so much more to character development than simply romantic entanglement. And I agree on AFNPC mods. Kivan and LR were the first NPC mods I've installed in years for that very reason. I'm thinking I may give Tashia a go, though I'm not keeping my hopes up. Just because a NPC has a romance attached doesn't mean that they do not make good party members if you do not intend to romance them. Don't dismiss using a NPC because they happen to be romancable--you don't have to romance them. Of course that is beside the point really, back on topic: I like the idea of an evil thief. There are currently several in production, I believe, but your proposal, even at this barebones level, appeals to me more than most of the other ideas around. One thing I'd like to bring up is Husam's drunken state in BG1, is this going to be a central part of his character (eg still a drunk or a recovering alcoholic)? If not, how are you going to explain it away? Link to comment
insolent_worm Posted September 8, 2004 Author Share Posted September 8, 2004 I did not mean to insult romance-based characters. I simply meant to say that romantic involvement was not the only way to develop them. I always thought of Husam's drunken state in BG1 as an act, something that made him seem harmless as he did his undercover work for the Shadow Thieves. After all, he sobered up extremely quickly when it came time to seek CHARNAME's help in dealing with Slythe and Kristin. I can see him putting on the drunk act again when he first encounters CHARNAME in BG2, but outside of that I don't think it would be used as a critical part of the character. I suppose he could use the act to deal with fellow party members he really would rather not talk to; heck, it could be that the only person he's honest with is CHARNAME simply because it's more beneficial to do so. Link to comment
Domi Posted September 8, 2004 Share Posted September 8, 2004 I suppose he could use the act to deal with fellow party members he really would rather not talk to; heck, it could be that the only person he's honest with is CHARNAME simply because it's more beneficial to do so. that would make him into a complex and fun to play with character Link to comment
CamDawg Posted September 8, 2004 Share Posted September 8, 2004 I'm with insolent_worm... Husam's drunkenness always seemed like a cover act, especially in light of his professionality when it came down to dealing with the assassins in the later chapters. That being said, it would be nice if his skills at bluffing, underground conntacts, and intelligence-gathering could be put to use in an NPC mod. Having the option to cut him lose from the party so he can gather intelligence for the next encounters or background info on key figures has the potential for a lot of good roleplaying. Link to comment
Domi Posted September 8, 2004 Share Posted September 8, 2004 Like investigating Bodhi when she made her counteroffer or Firecraag... but should be very careful re: spoilers. Link to comment
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