Unearthed Arcana presents Scales of Balance: a post-hac tweak pack

[Graion Dilach]

Newest versions of Artisan's Kitpack turned the Arcane Archer spellcasting prevention into an EFF gated op145 blocker which could be the source of this (YARAS doesn't pick up EFF-gates). The filenames to edit are C0ARCAS1.EFF and C0ARCAS2.EFF.

[subtledoctor]

Well that’s annoying - different mods implementing that is always going to be horrible for compatibility, which is why I went out of my way to write and make public a set of functions to achieve it in a way that any/all mods can use and have it work as expected while staying out of each others’ way.

Why do I even bother. 

[Graion Dilach]

This is the first time I heard about that repo. I don't see it in the common macros thread either, so probably that's why it isn't widespread.

[subtledoctor]

I posted about it several years ago, but forums being forums, it looks like it fell out if visibility. It pre-dated that “Useful Macros” thread. (There were also some brief, mild objections to the idea of one modder’s prefix being used in functions designed for communal use; but I don’t see a way around that, it’s a matter of practicality, not vanity.)

It still doesn’t seem to exactly fit in the Useful Macros thread, but I guess I’ll post it there anyway, just to give it better visibility. In addition to improved compatibility, it can save some time & effort so people lime Aionz don’t have to reinvent the wheel! (He seems to have reproduced it right down to the variations on “arca” in the filenames!)

[subtledoctor]

Been thinking about archers… with the SoB revised proficiency system, it restricts warriors to specialization at level 1 (just like the normal game) but doesn’t allow mastery until level 6. (Inducing you to specialize in a wider group of weapons with you level 3 points.) Non-warriors which can specialize in weapons cannot do so until level 6, when warriors get mastery. 

But for Archers, their whole thing is that they can reach higher levels of mastery than most folks. What good is this if they still need to wait til level 6 for mastery? They will be merely specialized with bows before that, like most schlubs. But the melee proficiency restrictions will hurt from the get-go. 

So what if, instead of letting Archers get higher proficiency, we just bump them up one step from whatever level they are at? Just put an equipping effect on all bows and crossbows, automatically bumping your proficiency by one if you are an Archer. 

[Endarire]

That can work.

However, what about just removing the early game cap on weapon proficiencies?

[Guest Morgoth]

On 6/17/2022 at 12:52 PM, subtledoctor said:

Well that’s annoying - different mods implementing that is always going to be horrible for compatibility, which is why I went out of my way to write and make public a set of functions to achieve it in a way that any/all mods can use and have it work as expected while staying out of each others’ way.

Why do I even bother. 

My suggestion is to post it in a separate topic so it can get visibility. I didn't know about this set of functions either.

[Guest Rythian]

Forgive me if I've misunderstood the math, but is the intention of the Proficiency changes to significantly nerf Dual-Wielding (Two Weapon Style)? It seems that the THAC0 penalties (-4, -4) make it much less viable than in the original game. If this is intentional, then I see the sense of it, it's probably too strong in the base game. I just wanted to make sure I wasn't missing anything before deciding what to put my pips in.

[subtledoctor]

I’m not sure it’s -4/-4, though I don’t have the numbers in front of me. But yeah the idea is, if you want to swing two long swords or two morning stars like a maniac, you pay a price for that. Now, if you’re a fighter with 22 STR and your thac0 is -12, and dual-wielding long swords makes your thac0 -8? You can afford to pay that price. But if you are a rogue with thac0 -2, instead you will want to dual-wield daggers or short swords, or a long sword and main-gauche-style dagger, and you will only get a -1 or -2 penalty. And in this case you get an AC boost out of it too. And you only have to invest two points for this, instead of three. 

In playing with it, I haven’t had the sense of it being nerfed. But I’m happy to hear others’ experiences. 

Edited July 22, 2022 by subtledoctor

[Guest Rythian]

I was going by the readme:

Quote

When dual-wielding, your main-hand thac0 will depend on the size and weight of the weapons you have equipped, as described below.

– wielding two daggers: 1-point thac0 penalty, 2-point melee AC bonus.
– dagger + anything: 2-point thac0 penalty, 2-point AC bonus.
– medium + medium: 2-point thac0 penalty, 1-point AC bonus.
– large + medium: 3-point thac0 penalty, no AC bonus.
– large + large: 4-point thac0 penalty, no AC bonus.

For -4/-4 for large/large. And yeah, I agree it makes sense to put in some penalties, I just wanted to make sure I wasn't misunderstanding anything with how the pips affected it. Cheers.

[subtledoctor]

Yeah. The idea is to create different use-cases for dual-wielding. Like I say, a very strong fighter with GM and thac0 to spare might eat the penalty and dual-wield longswords. Think about an Archer: you can only be proficient with melee weapons. But if you whip out two daggers like Legolas, you can have base 3 APR with a good thac0 - not bad for someone without access to specialization. A Swashbuckler who wants to tank can use an off-hand dagger as a main-gauche, trading two points of thac0 for two points of AC. 

[Fishmalk]

How bad of an idea would it be to install the YARAS component extremely late, after SCS, tweaks, ect? The only other SoB component would be potions for everyone which I would install in the recommended order.

[subtledoctor]

probably be fine

[Guest Morgoth]

Does the STO - Saving Throw Overhaul: component contained in this mod also have the INT bonus (more spellslots)?

[subtledoctor]

On 8/7/2022 at 7:07 AM, Guest Morgoth said:

Does the STO - Saving Throw Overhaul: component contained in this mod also have the INT bonus (more spellslots)?

There is a component specifically for bonus spell slots, which is distinct from the component that rebalances saving throws.