SubtleMods: NPC_EE - in-game customization for NPCs

[FenFalca]

Hey there - forgive me if this has already been covered (i checked but couldn't find it if so) - I just installed this and it's working on a new game, but not a game in-progress, meaning that none of the members of my party have the tomes in their inventories upon load.

Is there something I'm missing?

[subtledoctor]

On 8/21/2023 at 5:15 AM, ZenSojourner said:

I am using Skills and Abilities to get lock picking and trap detection for bards, with the aim of turning Imoen into a Jester.  Unfortunately after installing NPC-EE, I can no longer set lore in effects for ANY character in the party.  I can go in to EE Keeper and see that the pre-existing setting I had for my avatar is gone.  I can set it for both that and Imoen (Ch1 right after she joins the party),  save that, close EE Keeper, run it again and re-open the file I just saved and the settings are there in effects.  Open it in BGEE, check skills, and its gone for both characters.  Save that file, open it in EE Keeper, and the effect has been deleted out of the effects list for both characters.  I can set the parameter but it does not persist.

I don’t fully understand the problem, but from what I do understand, this mod should not be able to cause the effects you are describing. It doesn’t prevent any characters from being affected by any effects. It just puts a book in their inventory. 

1) Don’t install mods in the middle of sn ongoing game

2) Maybe don’t use EEKeeper, I don’t find it to be very reliable

3) Look for effects on your characters, maybe from other mods?

[subtledoctor]

13 hours ago, FenFalca said:

Hey there - forgive me if this has already been covered (i checked but couldn't find it if so) - I just installed this and it's working on a new game, but not a game in-progress, meaning that none of the members of my party have the tomes in their inventories upon load.

Is there something I'm missing?

The mod alters various files in the game; but once you start playing, a number of files in your savegame are no longer in the game files, they are inside your savegame file and largely inaccessible to mods. Generally, you need to install mods before starting a game, not in the middle. 

This particular mod might actually be okay to install after playing, but you will have to use the console to create copies of the class-change book. (I forget the name of the item file, but it’s mentioned a bunch of times in this thread.)

However, be aware, if you use the class-change book on characters who you’ve been playing with for a while (who have already leveled up), their proficiencies may get out of whack. 

[Sight]

Anyone know if its safe to reduce charisma on companions who don't need it for gameplay? I made a multiclass mage/thief Imoen and am adjusting her scores, wanted to ensure lowered charisma won't break anything. 

Searching around about companion stats shows me people have used EEKeeper to edit them all the time but uh, better safe than sorry @.@

[GawainBS]

In general, don't use EE when using subtledoctor's mods. EE breaks certain scripts.

[Graion Dilach]

What are you talking about? Most of doc's mods explicitly rely on EE functionality.

[subtledoctor]

1 hour ago, Graion Dilach said:

What are you talking about? Most of doc's mods explicitly rely on EE functionality.

He meant EEKeeper. EEKeeper breaks one or two things, it can wipe out repeating effects that a mod or two rely on. Stuff like SoB's dynamic stat bonuses and dynamic spell slot adjustments. Possibly 5E Spellcasting memorization slot management too.

2 hours ago, Sight said:

Anyone know if its safe to reduce charisma on companions who don't need it for gameplay? I made a multiclass mage/thief Imoen and am adjusting her scores, wanted to ensure lowered charisma won't break anything. 

Searching around about companion stats shows me people have used EEKeeper to edit them all the time but uh, better safe than sorry @.@

I wouldn't worry too much about it if you want to drop Charisma. Note that, in particular, even if you drop CHA to 3 with this mod, is you subsequently make yourself a paladin /bard/druid - any class that has a minimum CHA score - the mod will bring your CHA up to the minimum score.

[Sight]

1 hour ago, subtledoctor said:

He meant EEKeeper. EEKeeper breaks one or two things, it can wipe out repeating effects that a mod or two rely on. Stuff like SoB's dynamic stat bonuses and dynamic spell slot adjustments. Possibly 5E Spellcasting memorization slot management too.

I wouldn't worry too much about it if you want to drop Charisma. Note that, in particular, even if you drop CHA to 3 with this mod, is you subsequently make yourself a paladin /bard/druid - any class that has a minimum CHA score - the mod will bring your CHA up to the minimum score.

Oh no worries I am not using EEKeeper, I was just quoting what I found while searching around regarding reducing companion charisma. Anywho, good to know, will treat charisma as a dump stat for those who don't need it then! And NP on the minimum score - trying to keep it at least somewhat natural so that's actually a plus  :3

[Shadow Ranger]

I've run into two problems when using the mod to change Imoen's class:

• When I set her to be a Mage/Thief (Jester, Bard or Loremaster for example) I can't seem to be able to pick up Ranged Accuracy, Miscellaneous Skills or Physical Fitness despite being able to when creating a player character using the same classes/kits;
• She doesn't get a spell selection screen and as such has none (aside from these that are granted by the kit itself).

[subtledoctor]

14 minutes ago, Shadow Ranger said:

She doesn't get a spell selection screen and as such has none (aside from these that are granted by the kit itself).

Something isn’t firing. Do this in the console:

C:CreateItem(“d5clsp”)

You will get an item that lets you learn two spells in each level you can cast. (Go ahead and keep it, whenever you hit a new spellcasting level you can learn up to two new spells… though if you have already learned spells from scrolls it won’t work. This gives everyone a minimum of two spells in each level they can cast.)

Not sure about the other thing, I’ll take a look. I just started a new game with those mods in it, so I’ll look at Imoen. I assume you mean in the proficiency dialogue when she is above 1st level?

Edited September 24, 2023 by subtledoctor

[Shadow Ranger]

1 hour ago, subtledoctor said:

Something isn’t firing. Do this in the console:

C:CreateItem(“d5clsp”)

You will get an item that lets you learn two spells in each level you can cast. (Go ahead and keep it, whenever you hit a new spellcasting level you can learn up to two new spells… though if you have already learned spells from scrolls it won’t work. This gives everyone a minimum of two spells in each level they can cast.)

Thanks - could it be an UI issue again? I decided to continue playing using LeUI despite the problem with pips not showing when selected I've described before, as that was a purely visual issue. I might actually try Dragonspear UI++ instead (really dislike the default one).

1 hour ago, subtledoctor said:

Not sure about the other thing, I’ll take a look. I just started a new game with those mods in it, so I’ll look at Imoen. I assume you mean in the proficiency dialogue when she is above 1st level?

Yes - during the "rebuilding" process, in the dialogue window. And also when I later use innate "Advance Proficiency" ability.

[subtledoctor]

1 hour ago, Shadow Ranger said:

Thanks - could it be an UI issue again?

No, it’s most likely a problem on my end. Maybe it’s not handling multiclass kits correctly. If you have a save you coukd turn her into, say, a vanilla Jester or Skald or Illusionist, and see if she gets the item. 

EDIT - yup, tested, that is exactly the problem. 

Edited September 24, 2023 by subtledoctor

[Shadow Ranger]

16 hours ago, subtledoctor said:

No, it’s most likely a problem on my end. Maybe it’s not handling multiclass kits correctly. If you have a save you coukd turn her into, say, a vanilla Jester or Skald or Illusionist, and see if she gets the item. 

EDIT - yup, tested, that is exactly the problem. 

I can confirm that too, when I set Imoen to just a trueclass Mage I did receive the item. It does, however, like you said, grant only 2 spells (when I recreate a player character with Imoen's 17 intelligence I get 4 picks instead).

[subtledoctor]

Well, it is not designed to match the unmodded game, it’s just meant to give every arcane caster a floor of two known spells for every level they can cast. 

[Shadow Ranger]

2 hours ago, subtledoctor said:

Well, it is not designed to match the unmodded game, it’s just meant to give every arcane caster a floor of two known spells for every level they can cast. 

What I meant is that by using NPC:EE you get less spells learned than you would have if you just leveled that character normally - at trueclass wizard would, for example, get 4, not just 2 spells at level 1.

I assume it's just a limitation that cannot be overcome though.