IA v6 Final

[Saros]

Well, just tested Maze, and yes - it's obsolete. At least on regular improved Golems. Since those are fairly casual types of monsters, I think it would be irrelevant to test those BH traps more.

 

An Assassin - Fighter can be even made GM dual-wielder without losing any HLAs, just found out how. Level up to 23 Assassin, get UAI, level up to 20 fighter, get first HLA Hardiness, Don't level up until xp is enough for 24, pickup Power Attack-Critical Strike-Smite and Hardiness as HLAs, and now the prof points will be enough for ** in two-weapon style, plus ***** in longswords, warhammers (or flails) and shortswords.

 

As a side note to all who would be lured to try 'all' the improved weapons - don't attain more than *(better even 0) in bastard swords, axes, daggers, clubs, scimitars, spears, darts or slings. All those weapons have flaws - either nerfed versions of previously powerful Anvil weapons (like Death of the Thousand Cuts +4 bastard sword, Treefolk's Arm +3 club or Grandfather of Assassins +5 dagger) or are simply useless in combat (a good example is the early-obtainable +4 Boneblade dagger, but when you try to use it in real combat, your character simply cannot get close enough to stab the opponent, while shortswords have a greater range). Another good example of a useless weapon are the Volcano Axe +5 or the Club of Detonation +5, since the enemies those were relevant against in IA 5.0 (Ice golems), are extremely resistant to fire damage in 6.0.

 

Focus on traditional Longswords, Shortswords, Flails, one character on Warhammers (because there is only one CF), and maybe one on polearm-types (classic two-handed sword, quarterstaff, halberd).

[Saros]

Well, OK, Bastard swords may actually deserve more credit because of the vanilla Purifier and Foebane (although the second weapon comes very late in the game). Still, bastard swords are good only for F/T dualclass or multiclass dualwielders.

 

More testing: Master of Disciplines (grants 5% physical and magical resistance and 1 AC bonus amulet, useable by Monks) is still useable with UAI. Same goes for Cernd's Master of the High Forest +4 cloak. In addition, that cloak is the only item useable in combination with +3 or greater protective items (or armor). Same goes for Mazzy's Sword of Arvoreen and Jansen's Adventurewear. Ankheg's improved armor grants no armor class modifier, which is strange, since as a plate it should at least provide -3 slashing weapon modifier.

 

In short - an Assassin-Fighter wearing proper equipment (not the most powerful items like +5 ring or +2 amulet, but the most powerful in respect that no one else in the party may use them) can have pretty decent AC of about -12 / -13, physical and magical resistance of 30% (static) and also excellent saves (about -5 all), which I think is sufficient to replace fragile Valygar. Later in the game, he will obtain 40% permanent physical resistance (Warlord's Blade +5 or Defender of Easthaven +3), and be extremely versatile in every situation thanx to the UAI.

[kreso]

interesting. Never considered such late duals as effective, but looking at numbers...

from my exp with IA6, I'd say an ultimate party would be:

Necro protagonist

Riskbreaker

Riskbreaker

Berserker or kensai

Sorcerer

Ranger dualed to cleric

 

or

 

Necro prot

Riskbrkr

Riskbrkr

Berserker(13) -Mage

Ranger - cleric dual

Cernd

 

Both parties would have success.

 

 

@Iroumen

buckler gives you +4 to AC, which usually (by the time u get it) puts your swash to something like -14, -15 (depends on rings etc.) It offers no piercing protection, however. With Bluntness Girdle AC can easily get to an effective number of -20, even more quite fast (Gem and Coin have THAC0 of -10, btw). with prot evil, imp.invisibility, Slashing Girdle, even Granlords have a hard time hitting a Swashbuckler... even more with Acrobatic HLA..

[Saros]

As the bigg stated in a previous post, a Grandlord strikes critical on a roll 16-20 (think of it as riskbreaker with ** in two-weapon style). I'd rather prefer to have worse AC, but +20-25% physical resistance vs them, especially on insane.

 

As a side note, I just cheated in (solely via import-export) a high-level Assassin-fighter in my chapter 7 noreload party, replacing Valygar. Also retraced a little my steps and bought some valuable items for him. A two-weapon user like him benefits greatly from Carsomyr, and he currently fights with 70% physical (with hardiness) and 80% MR. The only bad thing about this guy is his few HP, but am looking towards Lum's machine for extra con point, also helped him a bit via Paladin's bracers and Girdle of Lordly might. His AC's gonna be improved by either Ghost armor scrolls or Potions of Defense (both items created by mage HLAs), will throw in Blur (also provided by mages) and other (limited) spell scrolls if need be. My guess is that this guy will be the ultimate tank, and will be able to face grave liches and dragons on equal ground, where at the same time a F/M would have a difficult time due to Grave/Greater silence.

 

Of course, such a late dual is almost impossible to make with no exploits, and the sole reason for the late dualling is the one and only UAI.

[kreso]

As the bigg stated in a previous post, a Grandlord strikes critical on a roll 16-20 (think of it as riskbreaker with ** in two-weapon style). I'd rather prefer to have worse AC, but +20-25% physical resistance vs them, especially on insane.

 

this equals cheat in my book... same as enemies using SI:abj + Spell Shield which I saw happen.

Ah well...fair game...

[lroumen]

Hmmm... it seems Sikret really likes single class characters. Nothing can dualclass into anything significant anymore other than using XP exploits which in my eyes is a lot easier to obtain with CLUA...

 

I think Swashbuckler -> Fighter would still be better than Assassin -> Fighter though.

[Saros]

Hahaha this is indeed laughable. I just tested a dragon battle, and it turns out that an assassin-fighter cannot use quickslot items (those are darkened) under Greater silence (much like an unprotected from silence ordinary mage or multi/dualclass mage). Also, the special ability icon of such a character is darkened (unlike a single-class fighter) and thus he cannot use HLAs until the end of the silence effect.

 

A Swashie-fighter will have better THAC0 and damage output, but unfortunately will lack the supreme protection offered by UAI and various items.

[Saros]

An example: I did a very detailed set of testing reports on a Necromancer-only battle late in SoA called "The Story of the Old Ones", in which you fight 3 enemy Grave Liches with the help of a high level NPC. The battle is fought without the remainder of the group (just the protagonist and the NPC) and is a very good example of one in which Sikret has deliberately tried to engineer the outcome with only one plausible tactic for success.

 

After about 10 tries, I ultimately beat the battle without needing this "Old One" at all. He was present and did participate, but provided very little meaningful assistance. I beat all 3 liches with what turned out to be a very simple set of tactics:

 

1) Use powerful defenses to survive everything the liches could throw at me;

2) Make the enemy liches expend ALL of their dangerous spells, primarily on summons. Once they were out of spells, they were easily destroyed by the summons that I had remaining. And I didn't even use a Wish spell.

 

Once I'd beaten the battle, Sikret dismissed my achievement, insulted me for ignoring his tactics on how to win (in other words, he wasn't interested in anyone coming up with a non-sanctioned way of winning), and proceeded to change the parameters of the fight in an effort to try to prevent a player from winning in any way other than how he wanted it. His way tries to force the player to instead have to depend on the Old One to defeat the liches for you.

 

My testing on this fight shows that actually the battle can still be won in a no-reload tactic, including Spell Immunity Abjuration, Globe of Invulnerability and Spell Turning. I see what Sikret has done after geh4th showed him the tactic - he simply made his Grave Liches shoot the Necromancer protagonist with Larloch's Interrupter. This fifth level necromantic spell disrupts effectively and almost completely casting for 1 round, dealing three minor shocks to the target. Since the spell is level 5, it effectively bypasses Globe of Invulnerability. However here is the situation in short:

 

Having prepared good contingencies (PromW, ProEnergy, ProElements, Foreknowledge) is essential, because the Old One appears immediately after resting inside the sphere. There is still a short interval after awakening and his appearance, which allowed PC to start casting Improved Alacrity. Old one appears, story told, PC agrees to help, both teleport away (but not before Alacrity casting is fully completed), protections on PC are dispelled, contingencies kick in. First action of PC is to drink a simple Invisibility potion, which forces the Grave Liches to start True Sight casting. All three of them, of course - Artificial intelligence, yep. Next step of PC is to press forward, in the midst of the Grave liches, to cast SI:A, GoI and Spell Turning. With spell casting speed reduced by 4, this is extremely fast, and there is even time to cast 4 RRR at 2 different grave liches, followed by Remove Magic, followed by refreshment of Alacrity.

 

Standing in the midst of the liches means that their next action would be wasted on ProMW casting. Well, at least 2 of them do that. Occasionally one of them casts RRR, which removes PC's Spell Turning, which is replaced immediately. Afterwards the tactic is short - strip liches of spell and combat protections, stay close to them so that they waste more and more rounds on ProMW casting, and in the meantime the Old one and summoned Elite Trolls take care of them quickly. Again, the battle can be won without the Old one, but he just keeps casting those 50-dmg Improved Disrupt Undead spells when he sees an unprotected Lich, so actually there is not much that can be done about it.

[lroumen]

A Swashie-fighter will have better THAC0 and damage output, but unfortunately will lack the supreme protection offered by UAI and various items.

Ugh... you are totally correct. You know, I carefully read all of the posts after mine and still I forgot that Swashies could not get UAI because it is just hammered into me that thieves just get UAI.

[Saros]

More testing shows that a dragon (or a Grave Lich) won't consider an UAI character as relevant spellcaster threat and won't target him with Greater/Grave silence.

 

As for 'Wish on Steroids' - the Recast Vital Energy spell - I wouldn't praise it that much. Its 8 options are somewhat limited, and although some of them are very nice, their duration of 1 turn makes them useful only in combat. Still, I wouldn't risk to use that spell in the thick of intense no-reload insane combat, because the last thing I want is an additional Skeleton Grandlord joining the fight. There are particularly 2 options which are good enough IMO - that's temporary 50% to HP of the entire party, or Regeneration for the entire party. Some of the rest are somewhat laughable - for example, PC receiving 10% physical resistance bonus for 1 turn - seriously, why a mage needs that?

[Nominar]

There are particularly 2 options which are good enough IMO - that's temporary 50% to HP of the entire party, or Regeneration for the entire party. Some of the rest are somewhat laughable - for example, PC receiving 10% physical resistance bonus for 1 turn - seriously, why a mage needs that?

Mental Agility is also handy, in fact it stacks so you can effectively get your casting time to 0 for all spells if you're lucky. But that's kinda pointless as you'll probably just be wasting your spells that way. One or two stacks of MA is good enough though.

[Saros]

Thanx, didn't know that.

 

Just finished 'Lavok's postmortem request' fight (developing no-reload insane tactic for it more precisely). A long, tedious fight, but not that hard - simply very, very long.

 

An item won from this fight is the Carmine Ioun Stone - grants +1 THAC0, +10 max HP and 10% physical resistance. Sigh...if only someone other than Necromancer could use it... Turns out the item is usable with UAI. Needless to say where it went. The Assassin-Fighter's physical and magical resistance are unparalelled in the entire party. 80% (with Hardiness) physical resistance - and this is even without Warlord's blade (which would grant 10% additional). I personally doubt that the necromancer will get that nifty +3 upgraded Ioun stone even if the third ingredient is found.

 

Some advice for necromancer-protagonist parties - collect at least 10 bloodstone gems and 5 jasper gems. Those are gonna be needed as ingredients. Also, don't scribe the Time Stop scroll found in Suldanesselar - instead use it as ingredient in the Planar Sphere. Don't waste a permanency scroll on a +3 Halberd, because one can be found from the 'Squirreled Away' quest.

 

Edit: Yeah, tested Mental Agility, it does stack, and spellcasting time can be reduced to 0, however I cannot find any use of that. It's pointless to rely on this in a no-reload game.

[Nominar]

Also, don't scribe the Time Stop scroll found in Suldanesselar - instead use it as ingredient in the Planar Sphere.

Yes, I scribed it and discovered there's no other TS scroll in all of SoA except for one place, the ancient dragon. Shouldn't be too much of a problem though. I think Ribald had a TS scroll in his special store in vanilla, am I correct?

 

Edit: Kinda funny that there's more discussion about IA here than on it's own forum. The last post on IA's forum was on 6th Feb and by no other than Baronius...

[kreso]

what makes RVE so good is - all options stack. 5x regen under alcatry is sick.

[the bigg]

First action of PC is to drink a simple Invisibility potion, which forces the Grave Liches to start True Sight casting. All three of them, of course - Artificial intelligence, yep.

It's even stupider - Liches ignore invisibility, True Sight or no.

 

Edit: Kinda funny that there's more discussion about IA here than on it's own forum. The last post on IA's forum was on 6th Feb and by no other than Baronius...

It's possible that he changed the forum settings so that the 'premium' forum is fully invisible, rather than hidden.