Unearthed Arcana presents Faiths & Powers: Gods of the Realms

[subtledoctor]

16 hours ago, Connelly said:

Any heads up with this? Less worried about Jaheira (but that too) and more about any possible issues behind the curtains.

The short explanation is, nobody is affected besides Jaheira. But I'll give you the long explanation as well.

The mod was developed with the idea that you would install a sphere system - a lot of the effort is directed toward sphere systems. The sphere system enables things like, paladins with ranger spells and rangers with paladin spells, and clerics with druid spells and druids with cleric spells.

But I try to make my stuff as modular as possible, so when I created the multiclass druid kits (a "druid/thief" cleric/thief kit, a "druid mage" cleric/mage kit, a "druid/ranger" cleric/ranger kit, and a replacement "fighter/druid" fighter/cleric kit*) I added a backup system that would give druid spells to those cleric kits even in the absence of a sphere system. This backup system 1) suppresses the game's usual mechanism for automatically populating priests' spellbooks, and 2) give druid spells to this kit. The game engine is getting its wires crossed a bit and not applying step 2 to Jaheira when she first joins the party. Maybe step 1 is blocking step 2? I don't know. But leveling up - even just leveling up her fighter class and leaving her priest class alone - fixes it.

So, to replicate this, 1) you must not install any sphere system; 2) you must install the Multiclass Druids component; and 3) you must install the Apply FnP Kits to NPCs component. This bug only affects this particular install sequence. Start BG2 and Jaheira will be a level 6/7 fighter/cleric with the fighter/druid kit. She has no spells or spell slots**. Bring up the console and give her 130,000XP so she gets her 7th level as a fighter, and she will suddenly get all her spells and spell slots.

This does not affect anyone other than Jaheira, because the Apply FnP Kits to NPCs component does not address any other fighter/druids.

* Why create a fighter/cleric kit for fighter/druids when, unlike the other multiclass druids, the F/D already exists? Solely for the sake of consistency. Depending on many factors relating to a player's mod install, the base F/D may have different XP progression and spell slots than a multiclass cleric, and using a F/C for this kit ensures that, on the priest side of things, it is identical to the druid/ranger, druid/thief, and druid/mage. It may differ from single-class druids, but that is less important to me than making sure all multiclass druids are alike.

** Now I think about it, it is rather odd that in addition to not having spells, she also lacks spell slots. And the game doesn't automatically give you spells if you have no spell slots. So maybe it is to do with her spell slots being suppressed...?

But at the end of the day: the in-game fix here is simple and easy (level her up); and the particular install sequence that triggers this is probably pretty rare in this mod (DO NOT install spell spheres, DO install multiclass druids and FnP kits for NPCs; and it only affects Jaheira. So I'm not super motivated to investigate further.

[Grammarsalad]

Lol, I know I should know this, but is there a way to 'plug in' to this mod? That is, if I have a spell, is there a way to assign it to a sphere, or if I have a kit, is there a way to assign spheres to it? 

[subtledoctor]

2 hours ago, Grammarsalad said:

Lol, I know I should know this, but is there a way to 'plug in' to this mod? That is, if I have a spell, is there a way to assign it to a sphere, or if I have a kit, is there a way to assign spheres to it? 

 

Yes. Spells’ filenames or IDS names can be added directly to the various sphere system documents. Each has a list of the available spheres at the top of the file. I don’t think we made a way to add spells to the system from other mods, which on reflection would be nice… but OTOH this mod is already so damn complicated, I don’t know if we should be adding more systems to it! (I had a thought the other day to moving the druid and shaman components to a new mod, for the sole purpose of simplifying and slimming down this one.)

For kit mods, you grab the fnp_compatibility file and INCLUDE it in the kit mod, then run the spheres-defining function like so. Most deities and ranger kits already have defined spheres in the sphere system files, so you can just specify the kit’s deity like that one does; or you can do it the more involved way per the linked instructions.

Just a caveat, defining spheres “the more involved way” requires defining them according to the original FnP sphere system, and the spheres don’t always line up to similar spheres in the “2E” or “Nu FnP” sphere systems. Assigning a deity makes sure the kit gets appropriate spheres no matter what system is used. And even if a deity is not there, you can just assign a deity with similar domains. Like if you make a cleric of Amaunator you could just assign “lathander_spheres” or for a cleric of Jergal or Myrkyl you could assign “bhaal_spheres” or “kelemvor_spheres”

Edited February 1 by subtledoctor

[Connelly]

About the item usability, some time ago I noticed some weapons changing types, like scimitars being considered spears. This only only changed the inventory pick up sound, but IIRC also caused oddities for other classes that suddenly weren't proficient with a scimitar because they hadn't trained with spears. I recently looked up at the code, and there's a simpler_usability_changes section that seems to be causing these changes in weapons across the board. How much is this needed for the component to work?

[subtledoctor]

15 hours ago, Connelly said:

About the item usability, some time ago I noticed some weapons changing types, like scimitars being considered spears. This only only changed the inventory pick up sound, but IIRC also caused oddities for other classes that suddenly weren't proficient with a scimitar because they hadn't trained with spears. I recently looked up at the code, and there's a simpler_usability_changes section that seems to be causing these changes in weapons across the board. How much is this needed for the component to work?

Admittedly I play the game with the sound off... are inventory sounds tied to item type??

Non-joinable NPCS and other creatures are modified to make sure their proficiencies account for these changes. So that is not an issue.

There is an option to not change any weapon item types... near the top of d5_fnp_settings.ini. Change it to 1, and all clerics will be able to equip and use all weapons, and only their proficiency options will be determined by kit. (This is like the old "Ashes of Embers" change, if you remember that... it simplifies things on a technical level, though of course it can have balance repercussions unless you exercise self-control...) You can modify that document and put it in your override folder before installing anything, and your settings will work even with mod managers that may re-download or overwrite mod folders.

[Connelly]

On 3/7/2024 at 6:30 PM, subtledoctor said:

Admittedly I play the game with the sound off... are inventory sounds tied to item type??

Yep, that's how I noticed first. I will try the ini, thanks.

[Magevro]

Having an issue with spontaneous casting. Sorry if this is somewhere else in this thread I am having trouble searching.

When I activate spontaneous casting for a new character and level them up, first level spells are not showing up in the cast menu.

This is BG1 and SOD.

[GawainBS]

Two short remarks:

Is it deliberate that very few spheres contain the Iron Skin spell? Is it intended as a nerf for Divine casters?

I created a Paladin (Zealot) of Eilistriae, Darksong Knight, I believe. She couldn't use any weapon, apart from blunt weapons. This doesn't seem right for the kit.

[subtledoctor]

1 hour ago, GawainBS said:

Is it deliberate that very few spheres contain the Iron Skin spell? Is it intended as a nerf for Divine casters?

It depends on the sphere system. But in most, it is in the sphere of Earth. Any kits with that sphere will get it - druids, plus various cleric kits. So access is actually a bit more liberal gan in vanilla. Only thing is, it might be renamed “Stoneskin” because “Iron Skins” is not very druid-y. But it’s the same spell. 

1 hour ago, GawainBS said:

I created a Paladin (Zealot) of Eilistriae, Darksong Knight, I believe. She couldn't use any weapon, apart from blunt weapons. This doesn't seem right for the kit.

I’m pretty sure paladins are not subject to the mod’s custom weapon restrictions. That’s only for clerics So something else is going on. 

[GawainBS]

Ok, good to know about the Earth sphere, thanks.

Other Paladins weren't subjected to the restrictions.

[subtledoctor]

8 hours ago, GawainBS said:

Other Paladins weren't subjected to the restrictions.

Possibly an off-by-one error? Can you find the Champion of Eilistraee in weapprof.2da, and see what kits are to the left and right of it? And/or, look up the kits above and below it in kitlist.2da. (Which should probably be the same.)

[GawainBS]

Sure. Where can I find the file? The F&P folder in BG folder?

[subtledoctor]

27 minutes ago, GawainBS said:

Sure. Where can I find the file? The F&P folder in BG folder?

Those .2da files will be in your override folder. Can view them with a text editor, or find them more easily with Near Infinity.

EDIT - can you also specify which components of F&P you have installed?

Edited 17 hours ago by subtledoctor

[GawainBS]

This is from the weaponprof.2da:

"D5_EXTRA4080          B_ZEALOT_EILISTRAEE   B_ZEALOT_EILISTRAEE_2 B_ZEALOT_GRUU"

 

Kitlist:

 

128                   D5_EXTRA4080          73211                 73211                 73212                 D5_EXTRA              148                   0x00004000            20                    0x00004080
129                   B_ZEALOT_EILISTRAEE   73219                 73220                 74274                 B_ZE10                149                   0x02000000            12                    0x00004081
130                   B_ZEALOT_EILISTRAEE_2 73219                 73220                 74274                 B_ZEIL                150                   0x02000000            6                     0x00004082
131                   B_ZEALOT_GRUU         73223                 73224                 74263                 B_ZE02                151                   0x02000000            12                    0x00004083

 

 

The install is from a while ago. I don't recall which components I installed and which ones I didn't.

 

Related: Can I adjust the proficiencies in that 2da myself? Personally, I think it makes much more sense for a Ranger/Druid to have Ranger armour & weapon profs, to distinguish it from the Mielikki Ranger/Priest.

[subtledoctor]

Oh, you're using an old version of the mod. TBH I'm not sure I can speak to what is happening there. Changing 2da table values will only fix available proficiencies, not usability. Usability should not be affected for such classes at any rate.

Best I can say is you are better off using the latest versions of the mod, which are the 'SD' branch (v0.86 - you look like you are using v0.85 or 0.84).

Meantime, I have updated the SD branch to v0.86.9, which fixes the spontaneous casting issue mentioned by @Magevro and also adds a French translation.