SR V2.9

[Demivrgvs]

Otiluke's Resilient Sphere

This has been by far the more painful spell to code, and it may still need a few adjustments! Anyway, it seems I've managed to fix all its issues (mainly thanks to this topic), and the spell can now be casted on an allied creature without allowing a save.

 

Anyway the spell uses "Hold Creature 2" opcode and currently Free Action doesn't protect from this spell, should it?

 

Note: if a mod will ever want to have the AI use this spell a custom version is required to "invert" which creatures are allowed to save and which are not.

 

Dimension Door

If there's a chance that this could break someone's game, I really don't think you should include it. Imagine playing through a large part of the game and then it breaking because of a Dimension Door spell that SR added. If such a thing is possible, I don't see how anyone can argue that the spell should be included.

I can make it optional, though actually it's already quite easy to disable a spell if you think you're better off without it. I'll think about it, but it's not a very important spell anyway.

 

Mordenkainen's Sword

The dispel effect should actually replace Death Spell for this "summon", because the Magical Sword is just like a Flame/Phantom Sword, the difference is that the caster guide it telepathically instead of wielding it.

While it sounds good, I'm afraid it may clash with AI that would generally use Death Spell for that purpose.

Once again, something that must wait an AI enhancing mod to handle it correctly. Let's hope DavidW we'll come back!

 

Should we add the dispellable feature anyway? I think we should, just like a Nishruu is affected by both Death Spell and Dispel Magic.

 

That is a really nice balancing suggestion, and even reasonable because teorethically the caster should concentrate to guide the sword and couldn't manage to mentally controll more than one sword at a time.

You probably know it well enough and can work it out, but just in case - there must be insurance that the wizard won't have to wait for duration to expire if a sword's already dead. I don't recall if vanilla's Simulacrum and Elemental Summoning HLAs attend this problem, but like I've - just in case.

Expiration time is the only way I know to make it...I'll try to see how planetars are handled, if I'm not wrong only one is allowed at a time.

 

Black Blade of Disaster

!!!

What do you mean?

Exactly what I've said - !!!

Ehm, care to explain?

 

Emotion: Despair

Do you like it? The original version actually is a mass Doom (-2 to attack, damage and saves) instead of -4 to to attack, damage, and AC.

The original is really bad, so remake the spell as it was intended.

I don't understand, you say the original is bad and then you suggest to make it as originally intended? If you mean to remake vanilla's "Emotion: Hopelessness" I won't. Hopelessness was already too effective even without SR's save penalties because characters failing the save were destined to certain death. One alternative is to make it work as per SR's Greater Command, but it wouldn't make sense to have two identical spells with different names and level. Another alternative is to make it work just like Sleep without HD limits, thus allowing a creature hit while unconscious to wake up.

 

Spell Shield

Make it to make the saves with 1 to all saves, +50% spell damage resistance.

What do you mean by "spell damage"? There's no way to make it protect from fire damage caused by a fireball without making it resist a flaming weapon too.

 

Energy Drain

As I previously announced I've added a vampiric effect to it. As of now I've opted for 20 hit points drain, but if you have a better suggestion let me know.

Well, I would make the spell drain 1 or 2 levels per turn with save on each turn against drain the effect(not the spell), until the creature is dead, or the caster is dead or leaves the area.

Golems etc. creatures could be immune of course.

Trying to figuring out what it would look like:

- each round target must save vs. death at -6 or lose 1-2 levels

- each level drained cures the caster of 5 hit points (does they increase max hp like Vampiric Touch?)

If it happens to be a consensus behind such a change I would still limit the duration to 10 rounds (both for technical and balancing reasons).

 

P.S Does creatures dying by level drain grant exp? I should look into it.

[Salk]

Anyway the spell uses "Hold Creature 2" opcode and currently Free Action doesn't protect from this spell, should it?

 

I think so.

[Ardanis]

Expiration time is the only way I know to make it...I'll try to see how planetars are handled, if I'm not wrong only one is allowed at a time.

Planetars/Devas are hardcoded, though the way to bypass it was found and included into G3TweakPack.

I've checked it, and it seems Simulacrum and Elem Sum HLAs do have an issue. They use 206 "immunity to spell" with the duration. Hence, it doesn't matter whether there is an actual summon or it has been killed if the timer is still active. The only way i can think about is to append their (and Mordy's) scripts either to apply that effect onto original caster every round or so, or to dispel the effect upon death (which makes a use of extra secondary types).

 

Ehm, care to explain?

Khm, I'm unsure what's so vague about it

 

I meant that was a great stuff

 

 

PS I didn't know the forum will recognize the spoiler tag.

[Jarno Mikkola]

I don't understand,

 

Spell Shield

Make it to make the saves with 1 to all saves, +50% magic damage(magic missile ) resistance.

What do you mean by "spell damage"?

Typo...

And if you don't understand, just dismiss it, I am sure I'll get back to it...

I meant that you should make the Emotion: Despair; -4 to attack, damage, and AC...

 

Does creatures dying by level drain grant exp? I should look into it.

I don't think so as you won't gain any from Int drain to death soldiers, while you do from normal death.

 

PS, there is a Preview Post button, for your codes etc. And yes it does, and there is a Quick Access too... if you use the real reply, not the quick...

[Icendoan]

Ah, but Quick Reply is just awesome.

 

Icen

[erik]

Anyway the spell uses "Hold Creature 2" opcode and currently Free Action doesn't protect from this spell, should it?

 

I think so.

 

Hold (#185) from IESDP? Modifying Free Action to protect from it will possibly break cutscenes now and then, which is bad. Generally, the "SomethingOrOther 2" opcodes are a bad idea to protect against, because they are used for special effects in cutscenes.

[SixOfSpades]

Summon Insects, Insect Plague, Creeping Doom

The "problem" imo with tieing spell failure to a "save vs. breath" is that pure mages have really bad saves vs. breath, and fighter/mages would be advantaged against this effect. Isn't a "save vs. spell" more appropriate for a concentration check to cast a spell in a difficult situation?

Hmmm . . . in this case, I don't mind, as the Insect spells are geared primarily against spellcasters in the first place, and it seems logical that a F/M would know better how to avoid what are, in fact, physical attacks. (Although it does seem wrong that all these little bugs are completely immune to powerful AoE spells like Fireball and Cloudkill. Perhaps in a future version of SR, we could make all AoE damage spells have the added effect of Dispelling Insect spells?) As for Breath vs. Spells, it's part of my Evil Master Plan to use Save vs. Breath on everything that I can relate to air in any remotely plausible way. If the bugs try to crawl up your nose, and scare you into hyperventilating, that's enough justification for me--because anything is better than resorting to Save vs. Spells.

 

Poison

It's also very common for spells to progress only up to 10th or 15th level (e.g. Fireball, Lightning Ball, Sunfire, Flame Strike, and so on), and the last "upgrade at 15th level already does a considerable amount of damage imo 6D6 + 60 is the equivalent of 23D6, which for a 4th level spell is enough imo, am I wrong?

And those spells that do stop "early" get a lot of bad press for doing so: Both Skull Trap and Cone of Cold do more damage than the equivalent-level Fireball, and are also less likely to hit enemies resistant to their effects. 23D6 sounds like a big number, but when it's spread out over a full turn, affecting only a single enemy, who has plenty of time to heal/Dispel himself, it seems a little bit . . . lackluster. Just a little, mind you.

 

Dolorous Decay

I do like the "plague/contagion" idea, but I'm not sure it fits this particular spell. If something like that will be implemented I'd prefer it to spread to all creatures, because it doesn't make sense for the disease imo to not affect "friendly" creatures. Anyway, I suppose that would greatly reduce the spell appeal for most players.

Well, high-level Tanks will almost always make their Saves, and Paladins are immune to Disease anyway, so I don't think people will shy away from this [hypothetical future spell] for fear of infecting their front-liners. Priests of deities affiliated with disease could also have their own, party-friendly version. One thing that we haven't considered, though, is the spell being targeted at A, who then passes it to B, who then passes it right back to A for double damage. So either the "second-stage" disease would be noncommunicable, or getting infected would also immunize you for the next couple of turns (or perhaps even permanently, which would be a nice twist of realism for the party).

 

On top of the slow effect and the -2 to Str, Con, Dex and Cha, we could think of an amount of damage which doubles itself to simulate the decay....on hit, -5% of the total HPs; -10% of the HPs left at second round; -20% of the HPs left at third round, -40% of the HPs left at fourth round and finally - 80% of the HP left at fifth round.

I think doubling each round is too strong; I'd set the multiplier at 1.5 for 6 rounds. That way, the target ends up at 0.95 * 0.92 * 0.88 * 0.82 * 0.73 * 0.6 = 28 percent health.

 

Horrid Wilting

The first suggestion [Water damage] doesn't seem "issue free", and I'm not sure I'd like to work on such a strange workaround, but it's indeed creative!

Magic Fire and Magic Cold may cause crashes, and I've removed every instances of them both in IR and SR.

Yeah, the Yaga-Shura thing would have stopped me anyway, but the main reason I dropped it is that it have harmed not just Fire-based creatures, but also anything with the slightest bit of Fire resistance--and, when the person holding the Wave has Whirlwind Attack or GWW, all creatures would have Fire Resistance. But what's this about Magic Fire & Magic Cold "maybe" causing crashes? How can we find out for certain?

 

Specialist Mages

Really nice suggestion Six. Anyway I don't think those innate spells have to be tied to known spells, as in PnP specialist mages are supposed to learn by themselves a few spells of their school. We may instead think about adding them their innates in their spellbook too.

No, they don't have to be tied to what spells they currently have scribed to their spellbooks, I just think it's a little inconsistent for them to be casting spells that they can't yet memorize. I forgot to mention that they should get 2 uses of each of these innates, not just 1: The first gained when they first become able to to cast spells of the given level, and the second about 5 or 6 levels after that. As for making their "Chosen School" ability a memorizable spell instead of an innate, I'm not sure how I feel about that: Players could theoretically fill every spellslot with that, and thus choose all their spells (of their school) at the time of casting, like a Sorceror. That I don't mind, because it's only right for Specialists to have that kind of fluidity of control over their own school. But I do mind the opposite, where the players fill none of their spellslots with the "Chosen School" abilities, as that would result in precisely the same situation we have now: Extra spellslots with no motivation to concentrate on your chosen School.

 

Ray of Enfeeblement

The victim suffers -3 penalty to attack and damage rolls, and movement speed is reduced by 50%, but a successful save vs. spell at -1 negates all the effects. Should it be stackable with itself? I suppose it should, and in that case the spell is ready.

Out of curiousity, how does stacked Damage reduction work? If cast enough times, will the affected creature perversely start healing its victims, or does the game know enough to cap the reduced damage at 1 (or even 0)?

 

Lightning Bolt

Do you like it as it is now? Should we reduce the damage and add something like a chance to stun 1 round, or a small 5' radius of collateral damage? Feel free to disregard the suggestions, I'm not even convinced myself of them.

The "collateral damage" sounds nice until you realize that that would make it just another AoE spell. How about single-target, and for every 4 caster levels, it makes 1 "bounce" to a nearby creature.

 

Dimension Door

It was already included in V1 though "hidden", would you want to reintroduce it? In that case I think a small improvement would be required to make it appealing as a 4th level spell. Instead of "teleporting" the caster once, it may allow a "jump" each round for x rounds.

Why not? Instead of being used just as a get-me-the-hell-out-of-here spell, it'd be nice to be able to loot the bodies of those archers on the balconies in Aran's Guildhall, without being forced to blow 6 Level 4 spells in order to do it.

 

Emotion: Despair

Do you like it? The original version actually is a mass Doom (-2 to attack, damage and saves) instead of -4 to to attack, damage, and AC.

I think it should be called Crushing Despair, to be more in tune with the Order of the Stick, and also cause immunity to Resist Fear / Invoke Courage, etc., for its duration.

One alternative is to make it work as per SR's Greater Command, but it wouldn't make sense to have two identical spells with different names and level. Another alternative is to make it work just like Sleep without HD limits, thus allowing a creature hit while unconscious to wake up.

I have no objection whatever to 2 different spells, which might draw their power from completely different sources, having the same end result, particularly as one is Wizard and the other Priest. Being able to cast Crushing Despair as a softener before Hopelessness only makes perfect sense, both in game mechanics and psychologically, so why deny the Enchanters a nice feather in their cap?

 

Spell Shield

1) 2nd level Spell Shield grants +3 to saves

2) Azuth's Spell Shield instead is a 7th level spell and grants spell resistance to allies

I actually don't like the idea of mass spell resistance, thus I'd prefer something like 1) though obvioulsy more powerful. Have you any suggestion?

Mass Magic Resistance doesn't sound bad, if it's a Level 7 spell, grants small amounts of MR that depend on the caster's level, and stack with multiple castings. But perhaps a Mass Minor Globe of Invulnerability would be better. Given that abusing this spell was one of the LEAST cheesy ways to fight Beholders, however, perhaps some anti-Beholder use should be retained (and appropriately included in the Description). I suggest: Every round, the spell has a percent chance (50% + 2% per caster level) of making the caster immune to Beholder Anti-Magic Rays for that round. Since the caster needs other protections as well, and their Anti-Magic immunity is capped at 90%, Beholderkin would still have a fighting chance.

 

Tenser's Transformation

This is something many of you asked for, and I've fortunately managed to do it! The caster gets additional attacks per round as a fighter of the same level (+1/2 at 7th and +1 at 13th). Fighter/mages won't gain additional attacks per round.

Niiiiiiice.

 

Protection from Magical Weapons

This is actually a technical change, I'd replace the total immunity with immunity to magical weapons from +1 to +6. What's for? Currently I can think of only one benefit: Black Blade of Disaster will have one of its most powerful unimplemented power, "ignores any spell protection".

Doesn't that make Black Blade too powerful now? How are we supposed to defend against that damn Lich in the Docks's Time Stop/Tenser's/BBoD?

 

Ruby Ray of Reversal

It does a few more things in PnP:

- a polymorphed creature is forced to its normal state (may be doable, casting a Natural Form spell on target)

- reverse a Flesh to Stone spell (it would make Stone to Flesh even more pointless than now)

Let me know if you think some of these things are worth to be worked on.

I'm not sure Stone to Flesh ever gets cast as it is, so in my mind the only real concern is what effect Shapeshifts Natural Form would have on Draconis and Abazigal. (Then again, those 2 could easily just be made immune.) The Trap/Knock/Web stuff isn't worth bothering with, IMO.

 

Delayed Blast Fireball

Agreed.

 

Finger of Death

Agreed.

 

Summon Nishruu/Hakeashar

I wanted to add a "dispelling aura" to them, do you agree?

I think they're annoying enough as-is, actually.

 

Control Undead

Thus I've made it not allow a save to undead creatures with 5 or more HD less than the caster (up to 15HD at 20th level). . . . Alternatively we may just increase the spell's AoE. Let me know what do you think.

I'd say do both, to give some incentive to Control instead of just kill. (See: People complaining about Viconia's Turn Undead not working like Aerie's/Anomen's.)

 

Minor Spell Sequencer, Spell Sequencer & Spell Trigger

in PnP their casting time is extremely long, and I'd like to implement it somehow.

Does the game not like casting times of more than 9?

 

Meteor Swarm

I've changed it to allow a save to reduce damage to half, but damage output now is 40D4! It deserves imo to be the most damaging spell in the game, and the new animation (which looks like a bombardement of minute meteors) makes tons of small dices of damage quite appropriate.

Is it still just straight Fire damage, or Fire + Blunt? I prefer the latter, because a Level 9 "most damaging spell in the game" being completely blocked by a Level 3 spell seems a little silly.

 

Energy Drain

As I previously announced I've added a vampiric effect to it. As of now I've opted for 20 hit points drain, but if you have a better suggestion let me know. . .

Trying to figuring out what it would look like:

- each round target must save vs. death at -6 or lose 1-2 levels

- each level drained cures the caster of 5 hit points (does they increase max hp like Vampiric Touch?)

By "permanent loss of levels," do you mean "permanent even AFTER a Restoration spell?" I sure hope not. Either way, I agree with granting the caster extra Vampiric hitpoints, and also making him immune to Energy Drain for the duration, under the logic that the levels he would lose would simply be the same levels that he just stole from somebody else. I like the "continual drain" effect, it would make it more appealing, knowing I'm doing more than simply weakening the bad guy's THAC0 by 4 points (if that).

 

Dragon's Breath

This spell is way overpowered:t does more damage than Meteor Swarm, it's party friendly and bypasses magic resistance! Being party friendly doesn't make much sense, but I wouldn't change it. I'd like to know your opinions, but if we let it bypass magic resistance at least we should drastically reduce its damage output to 20D6. It would still be as damaging as ADHW, with the advantage of bypassing magic resistance (which is a huge advantage!) and knocking back unconscious opponents. I would however improve it somehow, both save to half damage and save vs. knockback would get a -6 penalty.

If it were a Black, Silver, or other Dragon whose breath weapon is focused on a relatively small area, I can see how it could be directed to strike enemies only. But a Red, who creates a single giant fireball, has no realistic way to make it party-friendly. Ignoring MR, and potentially knocking enemy spellcasters out of the fight, is enough. (In this case, I see no need to treat SCS's AI system as a sacred cow: Just alter a few scripts not to use one particular spell, that's all.)

 

Summons: Mord swords have no mind so wonder why they should rebel, that was a oversight; genies and efreeti have a mind and not a strong bound to the caster so they could react, but it looks silly to me that a efreeti rebels if I cast a fireball in the crowd hitting him, while he's a fire creature and should thank me for the warm-up

True. Personally, I feel that NO summons should turn on you, unless you do actual damage to them while there are no enemies around. After all, the bad guys hit their summons with friendly fire all the time, and I never see any of THEM switch over to my side.

 

Protection from cold/fire and acid/lighting: what about a homogeneous solution, making all four spells protect the same amount, placing them all at the same level, and making the creature immune to spellcasting failure caused by spells of that element.

I'd also like to see Protection from Poison, for Priests only--maybe even Druids only.

[Jarno Mikkola]

Protection from Magical Weapons

This is actually a technical change, I'd replace the total immunity with immunity to magical weapons from +1 to +6. What's for? Currently I can think of only one benefit: Black Blade of Disaster will have one of its most powerful unimplemented power, "ignores any spell protection".

Does anyone know if there's any instance of items uncorrectly flagged that may bypass it? E.g. Vanilla's Arrow of Dispelling was flagged as magical but with enchantment level 0, and I still have to check how that work.

Well, technically you should make it either top at +4 or make the spell remove the immunity effect of the normal weapons, even if the creature is naturally immune to them, even from liches, for the spell duration. Remember that you can't cast both of them... and the reasoning is that you would be immune to everything.

 

Summon Insects, Insect Plague, Creeping Doom

(Although it does seem wrong that all these little bugs are completely immune to powerful AoE spells like Fireball and Cloudkill. Perhaps in a future version of SR, we could make all AoE damage spells have the added effect of Dispelling Insect spells?)

Actually if you make the insects not immune to every element, you'll get the effect. Yes, the insects are creature summoned by the spell... and their avatar is the insect swarm.

[Demivrgvs]

Otiluke's Resilient Sphere

Anyway the spell uses "Hold Creature 2" opcode and currently Free Action doesn't protect from this spell, should it?

Hold (#185) from IESDP? Modifying Free Action to protect from it will possibly break cutscenes now and then, which is bad. Generally, the "SomethingOrOther 2" opcodes are a bad idea to protect against, because they are used for special effects in cutscenes.

Are you sure about it? As Undead Hunter has this immunity and I never experienced a problem with this kit. Actually this kit should either not have this immunity or be granted completely immunity to Resilient Sphere, as of now if Resilient Sphere is casted on this kit it doesn't work as it should and I had to implement a not-perfect but workaround for it.

 

Summon Insects, Insect Plague, Creeping Doom

Hmmm . . . in this case, I don't mind, as the Insect spells are geared primarily against spellcasters in the first place, and it seems logical that a F/M would know better how to avoid what are, in fact, physical attacks. (Although it does seem wrong that all these little bugs are completely immune to powerful AoE spells like Fireball and Cloudkill. Perhaps in a future version of SR, we could make all AoE damage spells have the added effect of Dispelling Insect spells?)

Actually, the way I've coded Insect spells now has made possible to make Fire Shield, Fireball and the like "dispel" them...though only at the end of a round (e.g. a fireball is cast and at the end of that round Insects are dispelled). I'll try to work on that for V3 if you'd like.

 

Actually if you make the insects not immune to every element, you'll get the effect. Yes, the insects are creature summoned by the spell... and their avatar is the insect swarm.

Ehm...no. In BG they are not effective creatures.

 

Regarding the save, on a second though replacing save vs. spell with a save vs. breath may be fine with me. No one else has commented on these spells and what the saves should do, thus we're free to do what we prefer.

 

Poison

It's also very common for spells to progress only up to 10th or 15th level (e.g. Fireball, Lightning Ball, Sunfire, Flame Strike, and so on), and the last "upgrade at 15th level already does a considerable amount of damage imo 6D6 + 60 is the equivalent of 23D6, which for a 4th level spell is enough imo, am I wrong?

And those spells that do stop "early" get a lot of bad press for doing so: Both Skull Trap and Cone of Cold do more damage than the equivalent-level Fireball, and are also less likely to hit enemies resistant to their effects. 23D6 sounds like a big number, but when it's spread out over a full turn, affecting only a single enemy, who has plenty of time to heal/Dispel himself, it seems a little bit . . . lackluster. Just a little, mind you.

Spreading the damage in multiple rounds has also some advantages like disrupting spellcasting (and Poison's "damage each second" at 15th level is going to do it pretty well), and ruining warriors' initiative and attack animations (somewhat slowing them).

 

I've reduced Skull Trap's damage to 1D4/level but due to its type of damage it's still better than Fireball at higher levels. One way to balance them even more would be to increase Skull Trap's casting time to be more like Fire Trap, Glyph of Warding, Symbols and the like. Actually, now that I think about it I'm quite convinced that this must be done.

 

Those who consider Fireball's damage output too low are clearly wrong imo. At 10th level it deals as much damage as Flame Arrow but it can affect a lot more creatures, and even when Flame Arrow reaches its full potential it does only double damage to a single target. Fireball at higher levels is an easily dispendable, quick-to-cast AoE spell, and it's quite easy to have party members immune to fire. I actually find very easy in mid-late SoA to have at least a melee character with 127% fire resistance and help him casting fireballs on targets he/her is engaging, something like that can't be easily achieved with Skull Trap for example.

 

Dolorous Decay

Well, high-level Tanks will almost always make their Saves, and Paladins are immune to Disease anyway, so I don't think people will shy away from this [hypothetical future spell] for fear of infecting their front-liners. Priests of deities affiliated with disease could also have their own, party-friendly version. One thing that we haven't considered, though, is the spell being targeted at A, who then passes it to B, who then passes it right back to A for double damage. So either the "second-stage" disease would be noncommunicable, or getting infected would also immunize you for the next couple of turns (or perhaps even permanently, which would be a nice twist of realism for the party).

Obviously I already thought about it, and I would'nt allow multiple Decays to stack. Still, I'd like to hear more opinions on the "plague" effect.

 

P.S Paladins are not immune to disease in vanilla...which is a shame. I'll change it for KR but I cannot make spells taking into account mod changed/added kits.

 

Lightning Bolt

Do you like it as it is now? Should we reduce the damage and add something like a chance to stun 1 round, or a small 5' radius of collateral damage? Feel free to disregard the suggestions, I'm not even convinced myself of them.

The "collateral damage" sounds nice until you realize that that would make it just another AoE spell. How about single-target, and for every 4 caster levels, it makes 1 "bounce" to a nearby creature.

That was my original intention...but I really don't know how I could implement it...

 

Emotion: Despair

I think it should be called Crushing Despair, to be more in tune with the Order of the Stick, and also cause immunity to Resist Fear / Invoke Courage, etc., for its duration.

It was named "Crushing Despair" in V1, but I though "Emotion: Despair" a la IWD would be just as good.

 

Spell Shield

Mass Magic Resistance doesn't sound bad, if it's a Level 7 spell, grants small amounts of MR that depend on the caster's level, and stack with multiple castings. But perhaps a Mass Minor Globe of Invulnerability would be better. Given that abusing this spell was one of the LEAST cheesy ways to fight Beholders, however, perhaps some anti-Beholder use should be retained (and appropriately included in the Description). I suggest: Every round, the spell has a percent chance (50% + 2% per caster level) of making the caster immune to Beholder Anti-Magic Rays for that round. Since the caster needs other protections as well, and their Anti-Magic immunity is capped at 90%, Beholderkin would still have a fighting chance.

It's not a 7th level spell, I wouldn't change its level which is the 5th. I don't like too much the idea of a specific anti-Beholder feature. If the spell happen to be effective against them I'm fine, but a specific reference is unappropriate imo.

 

Protection from Magical Weapons

Well, technically you should make it either top at +4 or make the spell remove the immunity effect of the normal weapons, even if the creature is naturally immune to them, even from liches, for the spell duration. Remember that you can't cast both of them... and the reasoning is that you would be immune to everything.

I won't do it. Both things would seriously destroy many high level mages' scripts. The exploit on liches is intended, and though I do agree it's very unfair (and players can exploit it too!), am I supposed to ruin their scripts? I don't think it would be a good idea.

 

Summon Nishruu/Hakeashar

I wanted to add a "dispelling aura" to them, do you agree?

I think they're annoying enough as-is, actually.

They are somewhat effective yes (SR's gives them physical resistance and a feebleminding attack too), but I don't see them as particularly powerful considering their spell level. Especially the Hakeashar isn't too much appealing if you compare it to other summons available with a 7th level spell: Mordenkainen's Sword, Cacofiend, Summon Devas, Elemental Swarm, Elemental Princes.

 

Summoned Creature's AI & Genies

Summons: Mord swords have no mind so wonder why they should rebel, that was a oversight; genies and efreeti have a mind and not a strong bound to the caster so they could react, but it looks silly to me that a efreeti rebels if I cast a fireball in the crowd hitting him, while he's a fire creature and should thank me for the warm-up

True. Personally, I feel that NO summons should turn on you, unless you do actual damage to them while there are no enemies around. After all, the bad guys hit their summons with friendly fire all the time, and I never see any of THEM switch over to my side.

I do agree with you, and in fact I've done it. The only exception are summoned genies, but thinking about the reasons behind this I've come up with a possible tweak which may make them quite more appealing. What about having genies gated instead of summoned? I think this is already somewhat implicit, and being immune to Death Spell would be a huge advantage for a conjured creature, but after all they are conjured by a 7th level spell!

 

Control Undead

Thus I've made it not allow a save to undead creatures with 5 or more HD less than the caster (up to 15HD at 20th level). . . . Alternatively we may just increase the spell's AoE. Let me know what do you think.

I'd say do both, to give some incentive to Control instead of just kill. (See: People complaining about Viconia's Turn Undead not working like Aerie's/Anomen's.)

Well...both would allow to control multiple Death Knights...which may be a little too much considering SCS cast them quite often.

 

Minor Spell Sequencer, Spell Sequencer & Spell Trigger

Does the game not like casting times of more than 9?

Yes, because casting glows, sounds and animations lasts only 9 or 10, after that it becomes a little weird to see a caster moving the hands in the air with no sounds, and spell's animations.

 

Meteor Swarm

I've changed it to allow a save to reduce damage to half, but damage output now is 40D4! It deserves imo to be the most damaging spell in the game, and the new animation (which looks like a bombardement of minute meteors) makes tons of small dices of damage quite appropriate.

Is it still just straight Fire damage, or Fire + Blunt? I prefer the latter, because a Level 9 "most damaging spell in the game" being completely blocked by a Level 3 spell seems a little silly.

It does make sense...though that would make Comet a litlle less unique. Anyone else would prefer to split the damage between fire and crushing damage?

 

Energy Drain

As I previously announced I've added a vampiric effect to it. As of now I've opted for 20 hit points drain, but if you have a better suggestion let me know. . .

Trying to figuring out what it would look like:

- each round target must save vs. death at -6 or lose 1-2 levels

- each level drained cures the caster of 5 hit points (does they increase max hp like Vampiric Touch?)

By "permanent loss of levels," do you mean "permanent even AFTER a Restoration spell?" I sure hope not. Either way, I agree with granting the caster extra Vampiric hitpoints, and also making him immune to Energy Drain for the duration, under the logic that the levels he would lose would simply be the same levels that he just stole from somebody else. I like the "continual drain" effect, it would make it more appealing, knowing I'm doing more than simply weakening the bad guy's THAC0 by 4 points (if that).

Obviously a Restoration spell would work, and it may also block the ongoing draining.

 

Black Blade of Disaster

Doesn't that make Black Blade too powerful now? How are we supposed to defend against that damn Lich in the Docks's Time Stop/Tenser's/BBoD?

Lich in the Docks isn't your everyday encounter, and I don't like Tactics anymore for its cheesy scripts either. Anyway, how were you supposed to defend against it before? By casting PfMW a few instants before Time Stop triggers? That would be the only thing the new BBoD would prevent in such a situation.

 

The problem imo is how damn powerful Time Stop is.

 

Dragon's Breath

If it were a Black, Silver, or other Dragon whose breath weapon is focused on a relatively small area, I can see how it could be directed to strike enemies only. But a Red, who creates a single giant fireball, has no realistic way to make it party-friendly. Ignoring MR, and potentially knocking enemy spellcasters out of the fight, is enough. (In this case, I see no need to treat SCS's AI system as a sacred cow: Just alter a few scripts not to use one particular spell, that's all.)

I do agree on this matter, but it's not just SCS's AI, every script ever created considers DB a friendly-AoE spell, and I can't so easily alter mod added scripts...

 

Protection from Cold/Fire and Acid/Lighting

...what about a homogeneous solution, making all four spells protect the same amount, placing them all at the same level, and making the creature immune to spellcasting failure caused by spells of that element.

That is exactly what I had in mind, and to use arcane's icons for priest's versions too. I'd say 5th level for both arcane and divine versions as vanilla's Protection from Acid/Lightning (this will also "fills" both cleric's and druid's spellbook pretty well). Duration 1 turn/level is enough, and for those who still don't know it, 1 turn is 10 rounds!

 

I haven't talked about it yet because while the divine versions are easy to implement, moving arcane's Protection from Cold/Fire from 2nd to 5th level isn't so easy. Some script may still need them, and thus their .spl files have to remain somewhat working, while I would have to change their scrolls to cast and scribe the correct 5th level version.

 

Protection from Poison

I'd also like to see Protection from Poison, for Priests only--maybe even Druids only.

I've already included it somehow, 4th level Neutralize Poison grants immunity to poison for 1 turn.

[Jarno Mikkola]

Protection from Magical Weapons

Well, technically you should make it either top at +4 or make the spell remove the immunity effect of the normal weapons, even if the creature is naturally immune to them, even from liches, for the spell duration. Remember that you can't cast both of them... and the reasoning is that you would be immune to everything.

I won't do it. Both things would seriously destroy many high level mages' scripts. The exploit on liches is intended, and though I do agree it's very unfair (and players can exploit it too!), am I supposed to ruin their scripts? I don't think it would be a good idea.

But if the spell has no weaknesses, how in the unheaven are we supposed to take the user down? You can't hit a Demi-Lich without taking the 5th level spell down with 9th level spell(Spellstrike)... That's bad, very bad... after all why would the Demi-Lich use spells like Mantle, if he can protect himself from all melee damage with lower level spells... and yes, the custom scripts need to be adjusted to not take (unfair)advantage from unfair effects, same as custom spells.

 

Summon Nishruu/Hakeashar

...

They are somewhat effective yes (SR's gives them physical resistance and a feebleminding attack too), but I don't see them as particularly powerful considering their spell level. Especially the Hakeashar isn't too much appealing if you compare it to other summons available with a 7th level spell: Mordenkainen's Sword, Cacofiend, Summon Devas, Elemental Swarm, Elemental Princes.

The cleric and mage spells are not equal on the same level... Or is the Gate spell(7th level cleric spell while 9th level mage spell) same as Cacofiend, no.

[Raj]

Keep genies summoned and not gated in order to not mess with AI tryign to cast Death Spell at them, and leaving that spell useful against some high level summons ( a level 6 in order to kill a level 7 is okay, against spell protections there are even cheaper alternatives like a level 4 dispelling a level 7 and so on ).

 

Thinking about that, Death Spell is very nice during the first half of SoA but late in SoA is useful just against summons while in ToB it loses all the appeal. It's a bit silly for a powerful spell being lethal for a level 8 opponent but completely useless against a level 9 Improve it a bit maybe? ( like allowing to kill creatures up to casterlev/2 or casterlev-4, with a save for those higher than 8, or creating a death zone for enemies summoned later... )

 

Oh what happened to the idea of (Un)Holy word having a chance to kill gated creatures? ^^

[Demivrgvs]

Protection from Magical Weapons

But if the spell has no weaknesses, how in the unheaven are we supposed to take the user down? You can't hit a Demi-Lich without taking the 5th level spell down with 9th level spell(Spellstrike)... That's bad, very bad... after all why would the Demi-Lich use spells like Mantle, if he can protect himself from all melee damage with lower level spells... and yes, the custom scripts need to be adjusted to not take (unfair)advantage from unfair effects, same as custom spells.

You do know that I'm neither Ao nor the supreme ruler of BG, do you? I do agree this spell is way too powerful and exploitable...but I can do nothing about it. If it was for me PfMW wouldn't even exist, or it would be a lesser Mantle (protecting from normal, +1 and +2 weapons), but changing this spell in any way would create havoc in every script ever created that involve this spell. I cannot work on a Complete Baldur Revisions!

 

Furthermore even if we convince RR and SCS authors to take this change into account than we would have to make sure each and every SR's player uses SCS!

 

Summon Nishruu/Hakeashar

They are somewhat effective yes (SR's gives them physical resistance and a feebleminding attack too), but I don't see them as particularly powerful considering their spell level. Especially the Hakeashar isn't too much appealing if you compare it to other summons available with a 7th level spell: Mordenkainen's Sword, Cacofiend, Summon Devas, Elemental Swarm, Elemental Princes.

The cleric and mage spells are not equal on the same level... Or is the Gate spell(7th level cleric spell while 9th level mage spell) same as Cacofiend, no.

Actually they should, and they are with SR. That is why with SR priests don't get Gate but Cacofiend, and that's why even in vanilla priests got Summon Deva instead of Summon Planetar!

 

This is actually an AD&D's "feature" that I greatly appreciate over 3rd edition. Priests already have better thac0, better saves, more hit points, they can wear armors...it does make sense that to balance it only mages can reach higher level spell potentials, which are represented by spells of 8th and 9th level.

[Jarno Mikkola]

and that's why even in vanilla priests got Summon Deva instead of Summon Planetar!

 

This is actually an AD&D's "feature" that I greatly appreciate over 3rd edition. Priests already have better thac0, better saves, more hit points, they can wear armors...it does make sense that to balance it only mages can reach higher level spell potentials, which are represented by spells of 8th and 9th level.

Actually the Deva and Planetar were different creatures cause they would fill different purpose, to be the fighter/caster*.

*being the other support caster, so if you are a mage you get a cleric, and if you are cleric, you get a mage, that is able to cast (max-1) level spells. That's the real reason why a Paladin, Cleric and Druid can cast Devas, and Mages can Planetars...

 

And the cleric oppositions armor factor reduces to 0, while because none of them can't even touch your mage(PfMW).

[culmore]

I know this was mention in a separate thread apologies if I missed it in this one. But what about GoI being immune to dispel magic? Or is it to much of a nerf to paladins?

[Demivrgvs]

Death Spell

Keep genies summoned and not gated in order to not mess with AI tryign to cast Death Spell at them, and leaving that spell useful against some high level summons ( a level 6 in order to kill a level 7 is okay, against spell protections there are even cheaper alternatives like a level 4 dispelling a level 7 and so on ).

Guess what, I'm starting to think I should look into scripts to check if this is really true. I've just realized that the block used to cast Death Spell may just have a check to see if the target creature is summoned, in that case there wouldn't be a problem. I have to install SCS again...or I'll wait for Mike to take a look for me.

 

Thinking about that, Death Spell is very nice during the first half of SoA but late in SoA is useful just against summons while in ToB it loses all the appeal. It's a bit silly for a powerful spell being lethal for a level 8 opponent but completely useless against a level 9 Improve it a bit maybe? ( like allowing to kill creatures up to casterlev/2 or casterlev-4, with a save for those higher than 8, or creating a death zone for enemies summoned later... )

You're suggesting a sort of lesser Wail of the Banshee. Problem is that even allowing it to affect 9HD creatures means that the spell may kill for example Beholders. Would it be appropriate for a 6th level spell to have a friendly large AoE effect able to kill a pack of beholders?

 

(Un)Holy Word

Oh what happened to the idea of (Un)Holy word having a chance to kill gated creatures? ^^

Ehm...some of you are probably sick to hear this...but SCSII forced me to abandon this feature. SCS changes summoned fiends gender from "summoned demon" to "male" to make them not affected by Protection from Evil, and thus I have no way to make the spell detect gated demons. I'll see if I can find an alternative solution...

 

Devas & Planetars

...and that's why even in vanilla priests got Summon Deva instead of Summon Planetar!

 

This is actually an AD&D's "feature" that I greatly appreciate over 3rd edition. Priests already have better thac0, better saves, more hit points, they can wear armors...it does make sense that to balance it only mages can reach higher level spell potentials, which are represented by spells of 8th and 9th level.

Actually the Deva and Planetar were different creatures cause they would fill different purpose, to be the fighter/caster*.

*being the other support caster, so if you are a mage you get a cleric, and if you are cleric, you get a mage, that is able to cast (max-1) level spells. That's the real reason why a Paladin, Cleric and Druid can cast Devas, and Mages can Planetars...

Sorry but I usually do my "homework" pretty well. They do have different roles but they also have a very different power level! Planetars are more powerful than Devas in every aspect: better melee statistics, better weapon, better resistances/immunities, better special abilities, much wider spell selection, and so on. And this is true for any edition: take a look at "Planescape - Monstrous Compendium Appendix I" for AD&D or the "Monster Manual" for 3rd edition.

 

And the cleric oppositions armor factor reduces to 0, while because none of them can't even touch your mage(PfMW).

It doesn't make sense imo to compare the ability to wear heavy armors the whole day for multiple fights to the ability to cast PfMW for 4 rounds a few times in a day (which prevents other spells to be casted in their place), not to mention we're still talking about a 6th level spell, not a common 1st level Mage Armor!

 

Globe of Invulnerability

I know this was mention in a separate thread apologies if I missed it in this one. But what about GoI being immune to dispel magic? Or is it to much of a nerf to paladins?

Why would it nerf paladins? Anyway, I fear that would make MGoI and GoI really too powerful. If you want to stop Dispel Magic with a spell I think SI:Abj would be more appropriate. I'll open a dedicated topic on this matter as it's really hard to determine how effective are things like SI, GoI and Dispel, especially when they interact.