Summoning Spells for V4

[kreso]

I suppose that would throw balance out the window, regarding summons?

What balance? Ain't it crazy enough that you can have an Elemental Prince, a Deva, a Planetar and 2 gated demons at the same time?

I think that "remove summons cap" was there (Tweaks) for quite a time....

[Dakk]

 

I suppose that would throw balance out the window, regarding summons?

What balance? Ain't it crazy enough that you can have an Elemental Prince, a Deva, a Planetar and 2 gated demons at the same time?

I think that "remove summons cap" was there (Tweaks) for quite a time....

 

I'm pretty sure it was a hard (coded) cap? Possibly TobEx changed it though. And yes, that collection sounds quite over the top

 

The relevant components from BGIITP:

Remove Summoning Cap
Requires an Enhanced Edition game
This component will remove the artificial limit of six summoned creatures from the game.

Remove Summoning Cap for Celestials (Ardanis/GeN1e)
BG2, BGT only; Requires Throne of Bhaal
Courtesy of Ardanis/GeN1e, this component will allow you to bypass the hardcoded limit of one active celestial (planetar or deva).

[Jarno Mikkola]

I'm pretty sure it was a hard (coded) cap? Possibly TobEx changed it though. And yes, that collection sounds quite over the top

Well, artificially yeah. The creatures having a gender that sets so the players can't have more than 1 celestials... and 5 non-cels. THAT's only for the player. So a lich could summon billion summons were you to give it the time.

And the hostile demons/devils were not counted as summons, so there's no cap for them.

[kreso]

I'm pretty sure it was a hard (coded) cap? Possibly TobEx changed it though.

Sorry. The mod which removed the cap was Sim's Tweakpack, rather old.

[n-ghost]

I still vote for making a wand of Banishment and giving one or two to every spellcaster that could've afford it.

[Jarno Mikkola]

I still vote for making a wand of Banishment and giving one or two to every spellcaster that could've afford it.

Like the SCS sub routine for bottles ?

Well, it's a thing to consider. But it needs some balancing to thing about. Should every one of them have it... no.

[Dakk]

I still vote for making a wand of Banishment and giving one or two to every spellcaster that could've afford it.

It would feel semi-"cheaty" IMHO. Also I'd expect it as a drop when I gib the caster, which would quickly snowball.

[kreso]

 

I still vote for making a wand of Banishment and giving one or two to every spellcaster that could've afford it.

It would feel semi-"cheaty" IMHO. Also I'd expect it as a drop when I gib the caster, which would quickly snowball.

 

Add in specific scripting SCS would have to add to actually use this wand, rest assured, it will never happen.

[Jarno Mikkola]

Also I'd expect it as a drop when I gib the caster, which would quickly snowball.

This is exactly what I mean with the SCS potions... they have a high chance being destroyed when dropped, but not at every occasion, so it's a bit more balanced... it was ~75% chance being destroyed at one point. If you place them correctly, there won't be billions of them dropped. Or you could just add scrolls.

[subtledoctor]

I still vote for making a wand of Banishment and giving one or two to every spellcaster that could've afford it.

This is really not a bad idea. It would take a round to use, and a caster losing a round that they could use for another spell is actually a serious penalty. Far better than the usual cheese of

1. summon gibberling

2. enemy banishes gibberling

3. summon real monster

4 enemy dies helpless and screaming

 

RP-wise, in a land like Faerun, if I was a wizard and had credit at High Hedge or Sorcerous Sundries, I would absolutely carry such a wand. Everyone with half a brain would.

[n-ghost]

There really should be some kind of priority for AI spellcasters in terms of banishing stuff.

 

Because summoning 10 hobgoblins and watching a mage banishing them all one by one while you strip him of his defenses is no-no.

 

For example, outsiders\celestials\high elementals (including Aerial Servants) should get a high priority (mordies should get a magic missile\disintegration instead), large magical beasts, undead and lesser elementals is medium priority, demihumans and, dunno, bears, is low priority. 'Lowest' priority should actually be so low, the spellcaster must conclude that doing whatever else instead of banishing is better by that point.

 

Probably in terms of scripting though more viable (i.e. easier to implement without having to bother DavidW and wait for the new SCS to be released) option is to add AoE to Banishment and perhaps give some scrolls to the enemies (3\4 of such scrolls would be torn and unusable if their owner dies, blah-blah)

[n-ghost]

Also, probably a "banishment" option could be added to Wish spells.

 

That'd maze\imprison some member of the party if not correctly worded, kek.

[n-ghost]

Speaking of Wish spells, do they really need such a long cast time? It's annoying when no combat is around and makes them a suicide choice when there is one.

 

(they still have these long cast times, right?)

[kreso]

For example, outsiders\celestials\high elementals (including Aerial Servants) should get a high priority (mordies should get a magic missile\disintegration instead),

Outsiders like Planetars get Imprisonment usually. Mordies are better off as they are now - ADHW/Banishment. It's a shame loosing a 6th level spell like Disintegrate on a summon, even a higher-level one. It takes 2 or 3 MMs to kill a mordy. While this isn't costly, it's time consuming. AI can't really afford it.

[Jarno Mikkola]

It takes 2 or 3 MMs to kill a mordy. While this isn't costly, it's time consuming. AI can't really afford it.

A reason why the 10 HPs could rescue the wiz.

Or if you don't really want a, you just put a special Banishment opcode to Magic Missile that destroys the Mordies. It's a weapon made of force, you use a similar energy to destroy it...