Please check my install list (2.6 EET)

[Gwaihir]

On 2/17/2022 at 9:10 PM, subtledoctor said:

So, one possible answer is "it works with the most up-to-date versions of the mods, so update the mods.

So I did another full reinstall and updated the list in the first post.

I did a couple of changes in Tome and blood - the components for item/ability bonus to casting spells; also added two compnents: no opposition schools and revised specialists, and changed the innate metamagic in accord with the latest versionof 5e casting. Notably, 'indelible familiars' was skipped.

Well, seems like that issue with Imoen's displayed casting slots is gone. Maybe it was a problem with the previous version, maybe the latest update changed an interaction with another mod.

Speaking of spell slots: it does seem that some characters have too many of those.. at a quick glance I have:

- my protagonist: Earth mystic warrior with 17 WIS, at game start has 3 casting slots (including the earth focus spell). After using the change spells ability, it's revealed that he has 6 lv1 mem slots; and after resting, he has 5 lv 1 casting slots, plus 2 lv2 and 1 lv3 for the focus spells.

- Imoen: Jinxer, 17 INT (lv1). After changing her, she has 1 casting of doom. Changing spells: she has 4 mem slots, and after resting the casting slots are: 3 lv1, 2 lv2, 1 lv3. (2 and 3 are 'focus' spells);

- Jaheira: after recruiting her, she is fighter 1/cleric 2. (FnP fighter/druid). She has 4 lv1 mem slots, and 5 casting slots.

Then there's Vienxay's case: after recruitment she has no mem slots at all. I tried using the NPC_EE book to give her her same mage/thief kit (shadowmage) with no other changes. After that, she has 2 mem slots and 4 casting slots, that for an 18 INT character at lv 1 sound about right.

So.. it looks like some of the FnP and MnG kits get 2 spell slots too much? Or something? Not that I'm complaining, but its probably worth mentioning

 

Edited February 19, 2022 by Gwaihir

[subtledoctor]

1 hour ago, Gwaihir said:

Earth mystic warrior with 17 WIS ... has 6 lv1 mem slots

2 spell slots too much?

Some of this depends on what option you choose for stat-based bonus spell slots in Scales of Balance. Even with no stat-based bonuses, remember that priests are hard-coded to get the bonus in MXSPLWIS.2da, which would be +2 or more for 17 WIS. Thinking out loud (on screen)... I think the way SoB's bonus spell slots work for normal casters is to increase the slots in the spell table by 2, and then apply a spell reducing the player's slots by 2. Importantly, I think this spell is recurring and might take a few seconds to kick in. So, as is so often the case with my mods, if you click "prepare spells" and then immediately look in the spellbook, I guess there's a chance that it would show two slots too many. If I'm right - and if it's working - then it would resolve in a few seconds with the game clock running.

BUT, it kind of shouldn't be happening, because that repeating effect should be running beforehand. So you shouldn't see this unless you do all that within a few seconds of recruiting the character, or waking up, or something like that. I'll double-check.

----------------

Meantime, I did a save with Imoen at level 0 and indeed she has had some of QDMCM01.spl applied. I don't understand how that happened but maybe 1st-level kit effects get applied at level 0 instead of level 1... or maybe, hopefully, at level 0 in addition to at level 1. (This whole "drop the character to level 0" thing is definitely uncharted territory to me.) If it's the latter, then maybe I can patch the QD spells to only work if level is 1 or higher. That would be a pretty simple fix.

EDIT - that is exactly it! Excellent. The fix worked perfectly. A few updates should be inbound very soon.

Edited February 19, 2022 by subtledoctor

[Gwaihir]

1 hour ago, subtledoctor said:

So, as is so often the case with my mods, if you click "prepare spells" and then immediately look in the spellbook, I guess there's a chance that it would show two slots too many. If I'm right - and if it's working - then it would resolve in a few seconds with the game clock running.

Hmm, not really. Mem slots are 6, and they stay 6. I waited a good minute before doing anything. I'm pretty sure this was not the case for previous versions fo your mods; I experienced the 'abundant slots' thing in my previous install, which included SoB 5.36.3 and 5e casting 1.5.3. But with SoB 5.35 and 5e casting 1.5.1, the numbers seemed right: I remember Imoen could only cast the jinxer's focus spells because she didn't have mem slots at lv 1 - which is the intended behaviour, Afaik.

EDIT: another thing I just noticed - the cast spell button blinks twice after resting. Just loading the prologue start, going inside the candlekeep inn and resting. I tried clicking on it right after the 1st time, but the 'abundant spells' are already there. After the second blink, nothing's different. I say this because quite often I have to click the rest button two or three times, before resting actually happens. This behaviour has been going on for a while now, and it happened without the double blinking, too, so it's probably unrelated.

Edited February 19, 2022 by Gwaihir

[subtledoctor]

3 hours ago, Gwaihir said:

mm, not really. Mem slots are 6, and they stay 6. I waited a good minute before doing anything.

If the people seeing extra spell slots have been modified via the NPC_EE dialogue, it's also possible (likely) that the effect that was supposed to be removing those two spell slots was short-circuited by the level 0 thing - which is something I am fixing right now.

You can also look at MXSPLDRU.2da and see what that table looks like, since that is what controls memorization slots for Mystics. That plus MXSPLWIS.2da. Also depending on what 5E stat bonus spell slots you installed, it may have a weird interaction with priests because the component was written mostly for arcane casters, who don't have the same hard-coded bonuses as priests. I grafted on a bit to handle priests, but it might need fine-tuning.

If you are rolling Charname as an Earth Mystic and you are getting 6 mem slots at level 1, then yeah that's a different issue. But, one I can easily check.

Edited February 20, 2022 by subtledoctor

[Gwaihir]

11 hours ago, subtledoctor said:

If you are rolling Charname as an Earth Mystic and you are getting 6 mem slots at level 1, then yeah that's a different issue

Yup. However, this morning I rolled another one, identical, and this time has 5 mem slots. cast slots are 5lv1, 2lv2, 1lv3. Only difference was, the one with 6 mem slots was pregenerated.

I tried a few different kits at 17 WIS and checking their spellbooks immediately or after waiting for a minute:

- Beast lord warrior (very cool kit, btw) has always 4 mem slots at lv 1 - casting slots are 4lv1, 2 lv2, 1 lv3.

- thief/nightrunner of mask (has 40 thieving skills at character creation - intended?) has 4 mem slots, 4 lv1 casting slots.

- transmuter (17 INT) has 3 mem slots, and casting slots are: 4lv1, 2 lv2, 1lv3, and having all alteration spells at the ready, can cast haste/slow already in Candlekeep. Kind of op. By the way, in my game he also picked up the spell 'sex change'. lol.

- light mystic warrior has 5 mem slots; casting slots are 5lv1, 2lv2, 1lv3.

- heartwarder of sune: 4 mem slots, 4 cast slots.

In my opinion, the issue is not really the mem slots, but the fact that kits with some form of 'focus casting' get access to spells up to lv 3 right at the start of the game. Although I guess the two things are related.

EDIT: tried also a fighter/sorcerer.. could correctly pick 2 slots with the ability.. and casting slots are 7. At lv 1. Could it be that component 201 of Scales of balance is adding its bonuses on top of an already 'bonused up' charname?

Edited February 20, 2022 by Gwaihir

[subtledoctor]

if you could upload D5ZLTWZ.spl and one of those .CRE files it would be helpful. EDIT - no, actually I see exactly what is happening: you installed stat-based bonus casting slots from SoB and it is applying bonuses to high-level slots at low levels when you shouldn't have those slots yet. (Missed it because I always test in SoA.) I should be able to fix that. Oddly enough this fix involves dding a new stat check to SPLPROT.2da... in particular, the exact same stat check I just added to the update of NPC_EE I'm testing. So some of the code is already written, as of yesterday! Nice coincidence.

EDIT - already fixed. Just doing testing for the other fixes now, then I'll upload.

5 hours ago, Gwaihir said:

Only difference was, the one with 6 mem slots was pregenerated

In general I advise against "pre-generating" characters and I'm annoyed the option is even in the game. They will not process some initial kit abilities: I don't fully remember which, maybe spells with timing mode 4, maybe stuff that uses repeating effects. But some stuff gets missed. And the difference is pretty trivial between pre-generating vs. just rolling a character, starting a game, letting the game clock run for a few seconds, and then exporting the character. Probably 20-30 seconds difference. So I recommend the latter.

Edited February 20, 2022 by subtledoctor

[Gwaihir]

3 hours ago, subtledoctor said:

In general I advise against "pre-generating" characters and I'm annoyed the option is even in the game. They will not process some initial kit abilities: I don't fully remember which, maybe spells with timing mode 4, maybe stuff that uses repeating effects. But some stuff gets missed. And the difference is pretty trivial between pre-generating vs. just rolling a character, starting a game, letting the game clock run for a few seconds, and then exporting the character. Probably 20-30 seconds difference. So I recommend the latter.

Huh. Well. The more you know. Fortunately, that earth mystic warrior was the only one pregenerated charname I ever made. Thanks for the tip.

[subtledoctor]

Okay I just updated all my mods. New SoB fixes stat bonuses and spell slots, new 5E Casting fixes rings of wizardry, new TnB does ditto, new MnG fixes a couple small things with multiclass kits and improved compatibility with NPC_EE, and new NPC_EE solves those level-zero shenanigans and lets Imoen (or whoever) take on any class with any amount of XP and it works properly.

[Gwaihir]

7 hours ago, subtledoctor said:

Okay I just updated all my mods. New SoB fixes stat bonuses and spell slots, new 5E Casting fixes rings of wizardry, new TnB does ditto, new MnG fixes a couple small things with multiclass kits and improved compatibility with NPC_EE, and new NPC_EE solves those level-zero shenanigans and lets Imoen (or whoever) take on any class with any amount of XP and it works properly.

Holy moly you've done work. Time for a new reinstall. Fingers crossed, this should be the one

[Gwaihir]

On 2/17/2022 at 5:09 PM, subtledoctor said:

On 2/17/2022 at 10:54 AM, Gwaihir said:

after resting the displayed casting slots keep growing:

casting works fine, and Imoen can run out of spells, it's just whatever adds the little numbers it's doing it every second or so

That is super weird. Does it increase by one, or by multiples of the base number of slots? (Looks like the latter from the screenshot.) Do you have a '7th member' in the party when it happens? Do you have a savegame where Imoen has tons of slots that you can pluck out her .CRE from and upload it?

The same issue is happening again. It looked like it was fine at first, but then I noticed Imoen had 518 casting slots or so.. going back through the saves, I identified a save with the issue, and the previous one without. Both attached. In n°50 I hadn't rested yet, ever. If I set spells and rest from that save, casting slots work fine. (relatively speaking: Imoen can still cast spells at lv 1, which as a jinxer shouldn't happen). She has 3, it displays 3, and they stay 3. I cast a spell, it displays 2, and they stay 2.

But loading savegame n°51, she has 70 ish casting slots displayed, and they grow by 3 every couple of seconds. I'm pretty sure the only thing I did between the saves was resting, and doing a quest from Shades of the swordcoast in the same area. I did not rest a second time.

EDIT - Wait! There's an interesting update. Just found out that unequipping Imoen's armor fixes this. Tried this right now: loaded last save. Imoen has 15 cast slots and growing. Double click on her armor to unequip/re-equip. Cast slots stop increasing. Cast a spell, now slots are 2 and not increasing. Rested with the armor on, slots are 3 and not increasing. Seems pretty weird, but it makes the issue a bit manageable.

 

000000050-Recruiting Jaheira and Khalid.zip 000000051-1st time area - High Hedge.zip

Edited February 26, 2022 by Gwaihir

[subtledoctor]

Ah! Thanks for figuring that out. I didn’t even think to ask “is she wearing armor?”  

Armor is a bit complicated with 5E casting. It uses innate abilities, but we don’t want to block them wholesale, right? So donning armor removes all your arcane spells, and then it casts a spell every round trying to to give them back. But the armor itself blocks that spell, so you don’t get them back until you remove the armor. It works great, but I guess later mods like MnG allowing bards to cast in armor can complicate it. 

Now that I know what to look for, easy enough to fix it.

EDIT - I'm guessing this only happens with Imoen when you change her class to Jinxer with NPC_EE, correct?  I just rolled a Charname Jinxer and when I put on leather armor my spells "doubled" but then stopped increasing.

EDIT 2 - actually, the thing that allows you to cast in armor (D5ZBLAR.spl) is the same thing that stops spells being increased ad infinitum like that. So I'm not sure why/how it is happening.

Maybe loading a savegame somehow messes with the immunity?  So weird.

Edited February 26, 2022 by subtledoctor

[Gwaihir]

1 hour ago, subtledoctor said:

Can you tell me what mods you have that affect armors?

For armors, very little. Not YARAS. Armor casting for bards from TnB, maybe? (isn't that for single-class bards only?). 5e casting and revised bards are pretty much the cornerstone of my party. Also have a whole bunch of item mods that may add a couple of limited armor changes.

Here's my current weidu log:

WeiDU.log

[Gwaihir]

16 hours ago, subtledoctor said:

I'm guessing this only happens with Imoen when you change her class to Jinxer with NPC_EE, correct?

Well, I just recruited Garrick, who is a gallant, and he has the same problem. No changes made. After unequipping/re-equipping his armor, cast slots increase a couple of times by a single unit, and then 'stabilize'.

[subtledoctor]

Yeah the NPC_EE theory turned out to be a red herring.

It's so weird, I just can't replicate this. I installed 5E and MnG bards to get to the core of the thing, and there is a bug where when you put on leather armor it would double your apparent casting slots. Theoretically, the way it was coded it could have then tripled after you remove the armor, but I never actually saw that happen. I put armor on and took it off, switched between leather and chain mail, saved and loaded at different points in the process, but I could never make such a runaway process happen.

I've locally fixed the bug that leads to the apparent doubling (try editing LEAT01.ITM and delete the op146 effect that casts "D5ZARM1"), but I'm hesitant to upload a new version if there is still a hidden bug that I can't see...

[Gwaihir]

2 hours ago, subtledoctor said:

try editing LEAT01.ITM and delete the op146 effect that casts "D5ZARM1"

Did that. Equipped Imoen with a leather armor. Played for a bit. The issue persits. As before, it doesn't start immediately, but after a while if I check it's there.