Fishing for opinions

[Caedwyr]

Since there doesn't seem to be an Amazon.com style user/buyer feedback section on any of the modlists/download centers I must once again ask for some user's opinions on a few mods for an EasyTutu run.

 

The Grey Clan: Episode 1

Sirines Call

iiItem

iiProjectile

[Mike1072]

Since there doesn't seem to be an Amazon.com style user/buyer feedback section on any of the modlists/download centers I must once again ask for some user's opinions on a few mods for an EasyTutu run.

 

The Grey Clan: Episode 1

Sirines Call

iiItem

iiProjectile

I played TGC for the first time recently and don't regret it too much. However, I would advise against using "olimikrig's revision" of the English translation and stick with the "original text" option - I went with the revision and discovered a number of typos/ESL errors that turned out not to be present in the other. What you get with the mod is a good number of interesting battles and a semi-interesting plotline. I'll probably install it again if the sequels are ever released.

 

Sirine's Call was shorter than I expected/wanted it to be, but it was of solid quality. I'd also recommend giving it a try.

[Shaitan]

I would avoid iitem as it is too overpowered for BG1. There's some nice arrows, but the potions are too much and too many for BG1.

 

iiProjectile is great IMO, and should be mandatory for every install. Picking up at least some arrows after a battle adds to the gameplay in a nice and simple manner.

[Lemernis]

I just know that the Grey Clan Episode One: In Candlelight is very tough unless you have some tanks. I'm pretty good at this game tactically, but the one time I tried that mod I was playing with a very offbeat and intentionally "weak" party (to up the challenge):

 

PC Wild Mage "Spellshaper" 7 (via "Wild Mage Additions")

Imoen Thief 8

Minsc Berserker 8 (via Drew's mini-mod)

Xzar Necomancer 7

Tiax Cleric 6/Thief 7

Finch Cleric 7

 

and I found it too difficult. Minsc was the only true meleer in the party--that was just not enough. That said, using a more conventional party with a number of tanks I'm sure I would have prevailed.

 

The Lure of the Sirine's Call is a nice simple little addition to an existing feature (the light house on the sirine map), and nicely done. There's not a great deal to it, though (just in case you're expecting a great deal of new content).

 

If you haven't tried it yet, give Sword Coast Stratagems a go, it's a beautifully realized tactical mod.

[Mike1072]

I just know that the Grey Clan Episode One: In Candlelight is very tough unless you have some tanks.

I played with the Lite version after finishing the TotSC quests and found it challenging (reloads required on some fights) but doable. I wouldn't call myself super proficient at manipulating tactics in the BG engine - I often found SCS quite difficult with only half the components installed - but I try to play with a fairly balanced (aka OPed) party, tanks included. I wouldn't consider it a "must-have" mod, though, and there's always a later run if you've got enough to try out already.

[igi]

iiItem

iiProjectile

 

I heard that these mods rock. And, that the author is very open to feedback as well.

 

I would avoid iitem as it is too overpowered for BG1.

 

The mod is primarily aimed at BG2, however, which items do you find particularly overpowered for a BG1 game? Are they overpowered for BG2 as well?

 

There's some nice arrows, but the potions are too much and too many for BG1.

 

I'll never manage to satisfy everyone on the number of items added to the game-world (especially since the process is random), however, you can tweak the percentages yourself relatively easily in the .tp2 file. I'll post up some instructions if it will be useful to people.

[plainab]

iiItem

iiProjectile

 

 

I heard that these mods rock. And, that the author is very open to feedback as well.

Yes, these are good. Especially, iiProjectile. I like how you can retrieve knives, axes and darts as well as bolts and arrows. I even hear that there is a little script out there that will let you pick up all those projectiles automatically.

[Guest PetrusOctavianus]

iiItem

iiProjectile

 

I heard that these mods rock. And, that the author is very open to feedback as well.

 

I would avoid iitem as it is too overpowered for BG1.

 

The mod is primarily aimed at BG2, however, which items do you find particularly overpowered for a BG1 game? Are they overpowered for BG2 as well?

 

There's some nice arrows, but the potions are too much and too many for BG1.

 

I'll never manage to satisfy everyone on the number of items added to the game-world (especially since the process is random), however, you can tweak the percentages yourself relatively easily in the .tp2 file. I'll post up some instructions if it will be useful to people.

 

 

Regarding iiItems, I like the idea, but the mod is just too overdone and too overpowered for BG1. After having recruited Jaheira and Khalid, I had about 6 Necromantic potions that could be sold for 2000 gold. After defeating 6 Gibberlings I had 240 Arrows of Fatigue worth 2400 gold.

Way, way overpowered!

[coaster]

Apart from NPC Project & SCS (both must haves on my Easytutu install) I usually play with BG1 Unfinished Business (NB one or two minor bugs outstanding), Sirene's Call and Mini Quests & Encounters, all nice little mods adding a bit of content here and there. I found Grey Clan a bit heavy going myself, plus the fact that only part 1 of 3 is complete was always a little offputting to me.

 

Also have Hard Times installed on my current run, liking it so far but boy do those price increases hurt...

[igi]

Regarding iiItems, I like the idea, but the mod is just too overdone and too overpowered for BG1. After having recruited Jaheira and Khalid, I had about 6 Necromantic potions that could be sold for 2000 gold. After defeating 6 Gibberlings I had 240 Arrows of Fatigue worth 2400 gold.

Way, way overpowered!

 

 

Which specific items do you find overpowered - from what you've written, it seems that there are too many items, and therefore you can easily build up large gold reserves?

The number of items installed is random - if you install again you could receive a decidedly different distribution of items. Also, you can easily edit the TP2 to reduce (or increase) the amount of items added by the mod - I can provide instructions if required.

 

Do you have any suggestions to make them less overpowered?

Which version of the mod were you using?

 

Finally, if you have suggestions, questions, queries or complaints with any mod, it's good form to let the author know (usually by posting on the mod forum, or sending a PM) rather than just bad-mouthing the mod around the place. The forum for iiItem is here.

[Guest PetrusOctavianus]

Regarding iiItems, I like the idea, but the mod is just too overdone and too overpowered for BG1. After having recruited Jaheira and Khalid, I had about 6 Necromantic potions that could be sold for 2000 gold. After defeating 6 Gibberlings I had 240 Arrows of Fatigue worth 2400 gold.

Way, way overpowered!

 

 

Which specific items do you find overpowered - from what you've written, it seems that there are too many items, and therefore you can easily build up large gold reserves?

The number of items installed is random - if you install again you could receive a decidedly different distribution of items. Also, you can easily edit the TP2 to reduce (or increase) the amount of items added by the mod - I can provide instructions if required.

 

Do you have any suggestions to make them less overpowered?

Which version of the mod were you using?

 

Finally, if you have suggestions, questions, queries or complaints with any mod, it's good form to let the author know (usually by posting on the mod forum, or sending a PM) rather than just bad-mouthing the mod around the place. The forum for iiItem is here.

 

 

Hi, sorry for not directing my critisism at the right place, but your forum has a great disadvantage (for me) - the need to register.

Yes, I know - I'm weird and I'm lazy and I'm paranoid. ;-)

But that's who I am; I don't register at a site unless I *have* to.

 

Also, I get the impression that the "serious", ie more mature modders, are affiliated with Pocketplane and Gibberlings3, while TeamBG's modders are younger and more "munchkin" and has not quite learnt restraint when making mods.

Although your correct English suggests you are not a kid. ;-) For me there's no bigger mod turnoff than messages and ReadMes full of "u r", "cus" "sux" and such kiddie talk, based on my Morrowind and Oblivion experience.

 

I'm quite mature, or at least aged, myself and I value immersion and realism, and overpowered items and characters and monty haul mods don't appeal to me, which I guess is why my BG2 games always come to a halt in the Underdark...

 

As I said I really liked the idea of your mod - the more random distribution of loot - which is very welcome after having played the game half a dozen times already.

Maybe I just had bad (or good, depending on your view) luck in my game, but it definetely felt like a Monty Haul campaign, and why on Toril would Gibberling (or it may have been Xwarts) be carrying around 40 Arrows of Fatigue?

 

Some suggestions:

 

Reduce value of items. It's more fun and heroic to loot items from slain enemies than byuing from shops.

 

Make the drops make sense. The items dropped should be usable or valuable to the owners.

 

More install options. Monty Haul (current, I think), Balanced (blend in with vanilla BG), Hard Core (compatible with Hard Times. Increase selling price by 5-10 and decrease value by same amount. Make drops rarer.)

 

I was using version 5. I don't think the items themselves that I saw were overpowered - it was the sheer *amount* of them and their too high value that was the real problem.

 

Hopefully you'll read this and find it useful.

Just bear in mind that I'm an old fart - "the kiddies" may love your mod just as it is...

[igi]

Also, I get the impression that the "serious", ie more mature modders, are affiliated with Pocketplane and Gibberlings3, while TeamBG's modders are younger and more "munchkin" and has not quite learnt restraint when making mods.

Although your correct English suggests you are not a kid. ;-) For me there's no bigger mod turnoff than messages and ReadMes full of "u r", "cus" "sux" and such kiddie talk, based on my Morrowind and Oblivion experience.

 

If this is the common opinion of TBG, then I am sorely dissapointed. All I can say is:

a) I have a list of IE modding achievement longer than my arm - hopefully this would buy me some credibility as a modder

b) I'm not aware of any TBG mod, or modder, that frequently uses language such as you indicate.

c) The current crop of TBG mods is rather technically orientated; as such there is very little that can be directly considered over-powered (or under-powered - mostly the mods are just different).

 

I'd urge you to visit TBG, browse the mods, and engage the modders in dialog - if you do find something you consider munchkin, let the author know - it's likely not intentional!

 

 

Reduce value of items. It's more fun and heroic to loot items from slain enemies than byuing from shops.

 

Can you clarify what you mean by reduce the value? Lower the price, or lessen the frequency of items? It's extremely difficult to affect the sell-price of individual items independently of their buy-price.

 

Make the drops make sense. The items dropped should be usable or valuable to the owners.

 

This factor is slowly being worked into the mod. At least animals no longer drop potions! Usefulness is hard to define though - surely a potion is useful to almost anyone? Likewise, the arrows are skewed to end up on creatures that already carry arrows - if you have a problem with those creatures having arrows in the first place, it's not really a complaint against iiItem.

 

More install options. Monty Haul (current, I think), Balanced (blend in with vanilla BG), Hard Core (compatible with Hard Times. Increase selling price by 5-10 and decrease value by same amount. Make drops rarer.)

 

I've never heard of this Hard Times mod, however the varied install option has already been suggested by Miloch over at TBG, and is likely to be implemented at some pointin the future.

 

I was using version 5. I don't think the items themselves that I saw were overpowered - it was the sheer *amount* of them and their too high value that was the real problem.

 

This is much more encouraging; as you can hopefully tell, I've tried hard to avoid having overpowered items (e.g. +5 sword of freezing disintegration). Reducing the actual number of items added to the game is relatively easy. Please do try and be more specific in future though - people may be prepared to try a mod which is described with "there are a few too many potions/arrows added", while few would be prepared to try a mod described with "it's massively overpowered".

 

Thanks for the feedback. In order to avoid impinging on this thread any more, I'd urge you to register at TBG and continue the discussion there - or, register here, and drop me a PM. Or ask for my e-mail. Or start a new thread. Thanks again though.

[cmorgan]

I use iiItem every time - though I admit I need the extra gold to supplement my relatively poor tactical skills against SCS's AI (I need a ton for ressurection, for good equipment, and for other little problems... I bet the combo of Hard Times, SCS, and iiItem will finally pitch the game right where I want it ).

 

I also recommend the Learn Through Use mod of igi's, where you have weapons proficiencies and master trainers, but have never completed a game with it in place - not igi's problem, mine - I have turned into a chronic BG2 restarter, because of testing stuff.

 

As for the forums and modders, I think the heavies are pretty well all distributed. There are alot of good experienced folks who participate at most of them. G3, PPG, and SHS are a good start, but there is TeamBG, Chosen of Mystra, TolkeinAcrossTheWater, Rabain's Border Kingdoms, aVENGER's Realm (Rogue Rebalancing)... and that is a subset, as there are foreign language sites that are hosting and producing mods. All of the sites I listed have modders who are active and experienced, have forums with discussions, and in general use the "let's get along and work reasonably well together" mentalities. They even let some of us Old Dudes hang out -

 

(side note - igi maintains DLTCEPthe IESDP and is pretty much a serious technical dude. Definitely one of the Heavies - it just takes some forum reading to get the Who's Who, because lots of folks are dropping in intermittently because of RL concerns).

 

igi, I will drop by TeamBG with EasyTutu results next time I run through - I like it the way it is, but I suspect you could tweak the potions and arrows numbers possible way down on the Tutu side. The flavor items are my favorite; I really like the immersion factor of having some items that no party needs or could use in BG hanging aroujnd. It adds to the immersion, in my opinion!

 

//Edited for miscredit - typed DLTCEP instead of IESDP... bleh Thanks for the correction, Miloch...

[Miloch]

(side note - igi maintains DLTCEP IESDP and is pretty much a serious technical dude. Definitely one of the Heavies - it just takes some forum reading to get the Who's Who, because lots of folks are dropping in intermittently because of RL concerns).

 

(Another side note - the original TeamBG site was responsible for some of the oldest modding material around, back there weren't any real modding tools and everything was done with hex editors. Though I'm not sure of the exact relation to the newer teambg.eu but there is some connection I think.)

 

I already commented on some of these things here but feel free to add to the post.

[Guest PetrusOctavianus]

(Another side note - the original TeamBG site was responsible for some of the oldest modding material around, back there weren't any real modding tools and everything was done with hex editors. Though I'm not sure of the exact relation to the newer teambg.eu but there is some connection I think.)

 

Yes, they made The Darkest Day and Dark Side of the Sword Coast, didn't they?

I never tried them, after hearing about them being buggy (understandable if no proper tools are available) and too overpowered (which I generally take as a sign of immaturity).

 

So for me personally (I can't speak for others and I haven't even discussed it with others) TeamBG has a lower "reputation" than Pocketplane and Gibberlings3.

 

It may be unfair and the current modders may not be the same, but there you have it.