Roxanne's Inofficial Mod Versions

[subtledoctor]

23 minutes ago, Jazira said:

 for promoting her own mod on the tool she maintain, if i've been her i would have done the same, and most of you too let's be honest. Maybe not in the same way but still.

Uh, no.  I mean there's not really any way to test but

OH WAIT, I've published a mod installer myself, for Mac platforms, and what do you know, it treats my mods exactly the same as every other one - nothing is privileged. 

23 minutes ago, Jazira said:

I just wish the better for the community. I'm done with this subject, i'm sorry for opening old wounds and if i have offensed anyone.

No worries!  Your sentiment is appreciated.  Unfortunately it does not appear that Roxanne shares your wish for the community, else she would communicate and collaborate more with other modders, and not practice deception with the community.  (And btw she routinely deceives the people on her own forums over there, so anyone can say those newcomers are "better off" with her tool but that statement itself is based on misinformation, so who really knows?  )

As many have said, she is always welcome to participate around here; people using her stuff would be better off for getting good information from modders here, and people here would be better off for having her expertise communicated.  She is the one who decided to quarantine herself, she can undo it at any time.  Her absence - and her failure to source good information for people using her tool - is entirely on her.

(Frankly I don't even care anymore if she prevents my mods being used on her installer.  It bothered me to no end when she did it with the BWS.  But as long as her fork of it is honestly billed as her own proprietary thing (and as long as she credits people, like @AL|EN, who really made the thing she is using and distributing), then she can do whatever the heck she wants with it.)

[subtledoctor]

4 hours ago, Azazello said:

Despite past 'indiscretions', s/he still posts infrequently (at least, under known aliases) on RPGCodex. {sorry, I don't know which is the newest post}

Interesting!  That place is full of terrible people, I find it hard to even read threads there.  But out of curiosity, which are Roxanne's alts there?  From a cursory glance at the link, I assume Strantar?

Edited May 4, 2020 by subtledoctor

[Jarno Mikkola]

31 minutes ago, subtledoctor said:

Interesting!  That place is full of terrible incels, I find it hard to even read threads there.  But out of curiosity, which are Roxanne's alts there?  From a cursory glance at the link, I assume Strantar?

Really, you want to go there. Yey, let's harass that person too.

Just in case you didn't notice, THAT*S REALLY FUCKED UP !

Edited May 4, 2020 by Jarno Mikkola

[subtledoctor]

Fair enough.

Edited May 5, 2020 by subtledoctor

[Azazello]

 

5 hours ago, subtledoctor said:

Interesting!  That place is full of terrible people, I find it hard to even read threads there.  But out of curiosity, which are Roxanne's alts there?  From a cursory glance at the link, I assume Strantar?

RPGCodex is definitely not everyone's cup o' tea. It's reminds me of the first BG-related forum I joined, back in the day. Codex is much worse, of course, but still has its own appeal.

But you can still get some useful nuggets on occasion e.g. https://rpgcodex.net/forums/index.php?threads/ssis-gold-box-series-thread.61389/page-48#post-2330009

I'll agree with Jarno on this one (what?!! )-- I don't want or mean to start a witchhunt - if anyone wants to learn the aliases, they can be found relatively easily.

Edited May 5, 2020 by Azazello

[Ardanis]

On 5/3/2020 at 5:57 AM, Jarno Mikkola said:

could you please look into this forum, and say that Roxanne was not involved in any of the stuff they claim to be.

Is Roxanne even aware of the original project, to begin with? Or has she been informed of its existence, in case there were doubts? The only reason I even know about it, is because I remember a decade old thread on SHS, so if you weren't around there back then and don't check on every recently active thread now, you'd be forgiven for being ignorant.

[jastey]

43 minutes ago, Ardanis said:

Is Roxanne even aware of the original project, to begin with? Or has she been informed of its existence, in case there were doubts? The only reason I even know about it, is because I remember a decade old thread on SHS, so if you weren't around there back then and don't check on every recently active thread now, you'd be forgiven for being ignorant.

In case that refers to the Balduran Seatower areas: WithinAmnesia took them out of the hidden workroom against our explicit statement and went to Roxanne with them who made a mod out of it stating it's from "Roxanne and WithinAmnesia". Nuff said.

[Jarno Mikkola]

So the simple answer to your question Ardanis is: no.

And the most likely case here is that WithinAmnesia took the map and made the mod with Roxannes help because they felt that it would never come out without them doing it themselves. It was years... or like said:

5 hours ago, Ardanis said:

a decade old thread on SHS

Edited May 5, 2020 by Jarno Mikkola

[subtledoctor]

1 hour ago, Jarno Mikkola said:

So the simple answer to your question Ardanis is: no.

And the most likely case here is that WithinAmnesia took the map and made the mod with Roxannes help because they felt that it would never come out without them doing it themselves. It was years... or like said:

Uh, WithinAmnesia had by all accounts been communicating with and working with the actual modders very recently.  So they knew perfectly well it was not abandonware.  Feeling like someone is taking too long is not a reason to take the fruits of their labor and go forward without them. 

If you think it needs defending, or you have actual facts that show the behavior in a different light, by all means let people know.  But why are you springing to their defense with poor logic and half-truths?  It's kind of weird.

Let's be honest, Roxanne doesn't have the modding chops to do a mod like Balduran's Seatower.  She claims authorship but of course that's BS - it is way beyond what she generally does with mods, which is basically to just sprinkle some NPCs and dialogues/interjections into other peoples' work. 

[Ardanis]

38 minutes ago, subtledoctor said:

If you think it needs defending, or you have actual facts that show the behavior in a different light, by all means let people know.  But why are you springing to their defense with poor logic and half-truths?  It's kind of weird.

I'm just slightly concerned that we don't have a repeat of the witch hunt from couple years ago, when some people have been ranting about what a Satan incarnate Roxanne was, when in the links they provided as "proof" she's only been responding to players who asked for help. So I hope you'll forgive me for inquiring whether the Seatower case is a fact or just speculation that Amnesia told her where did he get the files.

Edited May 5, 2020 by Ardanis

[subtledoctor]

I’m just saying, she has it for download under the “My Mods” section of her website, and whatever her level of knowledge about where WithinAmnesia got the work (though it was pretty clear that guy was a newbie to this stuff and could not have done it on his own)... she damn well knows that she didn’t do the work. 

Which, fair’s fair, does not make her satan at all. But the information is put there now, she knows well what the situation is. So like I said originally, she is welcome to participate around here... but if she wants to be treated with respect, there are some concrete steps she should take to show that she respects others. Like, stop offering for download the mod with stolen work. That’s pretty simple, and easy, and would go a long way. 

[Jarno Mikkola]

OK, so your rant about stolen stuff... let's apply it to the map. It's at least partially STOLEN. Steal from a stealer, nothing is lost. Just saying.

[Cahir]

3 hours ago, Jarno Mikkola said:

OK, so your rant about stolen stuff... let's apply it to the map. It's at least partially STOLEN. Steal from a stealer, nothing is lost. Just saying.

Jarno, either you're trolling right now or you just  wouldn't scruple to do the same. You've got every bit of info what they both have done wrong and you're still trying to twist @subtledoctor's words to defend her.

@Ardanis this was not a with hunt, this was gathering proof (which is not that easy) that it was in fact Roxanne who used all those alts after all. It would indeed be witch hunt if she got banned from Beamdog without this proof.

Besides she stepped on so many modders' toes that at this point defending her is just saying that all those modders are just petty and jelous whiners and she can do literally anything just to release new content. No she can't, she can't use stolen art and claim she is the author of it, she can't modify other modders work without permission, she should take down those mods from her site after official EET versions released, especially when original authors showed up after many years of silence to show disapproval of here actions. So yeah, call me witch hunter if you want, but she is by all means not without the guilt. 

BTW: I'm not sure if Roxanne is she or he and it is generally unknown, but her nick implies a woman, so she's "she" for me. Just and word of explanation for Jarno in case he would like to activate himself about it. 

[subtledoctor]

Jarno, more bad logic. Aren’t imps supposed to be good at that sort of thing? Maybe we should call you The Quasit...

[Greenhorn]

Roxanne was ( and is ) one of the most able remaining modders left in this particular community. She helped me ( and many other players besides ) countless times so much so that you could rely on her almost to the degree of all round the clock tech support. I played her stuff and found good and bad sides to it, not everybody's cup of tea, definitely but not without merits too . I don't mind some things that bother other people but including other modders work without their consent is serious misstep ( not abandoned mods in one form or the other but maintained stuff still supported by their authors). Not because it bothers this and that player but because it represent particular modder's work in a light never envisioned or condoned by them and disrespect their work ( from the point of view of those authors). From that point things got worse. I was sorry to see her go after her jig was up ( and by all ugly things which followed) but when you make misstep ( or serious error in judgment ) you are bound to slip and fall. As for Balduran's seatower I indeed find her less guilty of two involved "authors" in that fiasco but again it was auto goal by her. I have this wishful thinking that old wrongs can be forgotten and forgiven, hatches buried  and some compromise reached for the good of all community because whether you like it or not she is talented and proficient modder. But it is not likely.  There is no good will from either side truthfully and things become more... personal.